Third Civil War

[Mizriath]

Hi Fel,

I knew you wrote somewhere about the Third Civil War. This is information I missed that I thought would complete the story.

There are the Seditionists which was headed by Merrane. Who are the other noble houses. Does this include Trillane? Definitely the Suralles is on Merrane side.

The Loyalist would definitely be headed by Shevalle. Is this the same as the Shovalles mentioned in Chapter 19?? or is the Shevalle destroyed after the war. Who are the other noble houses on the Loyalists side?

Who are the remaining 12 noble houses besides Merrane? The Trillane, Surrales, Shovalles, Enalles and Zovannes.

Well, just to close out the politics of the Imperium.

Miz

[Fel]

transcribed from the notebook.

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There are 43 houses of the Siann. 12 of them are Highborn houses, houses blood related to Dahnai Merrane. The remaining 31 houses are Minor houses.

The Highborn houses, listed by power/size:

1: Merrane, Imperial House, led by Shaba Merrane, with Dahnai Merrane as Empress. Dahnai keeps Merrane competetive with the larger houses of Shovalle and Trillane through her authority.

2: Dorrane, led by Semoya Dorrane. Dorrane is actually the largest of all the houses, and is planning to try to take the throne.

3: Trillane, led by Maeri Trillane. Trillane has the largest house military of all the Highborn houses, and has the military capacity to wage war with Imperial forces in a one-on-one scenario.

4: Shovalle, led by Hillina Shovalle. Shovalle was the house before Merrane to hold the Imperial throne, and has been secretly approached by Dorrane and Trillane to ally and overthrow Merrane. Shovalle plans to play both houses against each other then betray them both, start a civil war, and then try to seize the throne again as the top three houses destroy each other.

5: Enalle, led by Stera Enalle. Enalle is hoping for a war between the top houses, so they can eliminate enough competition to take the throne.

6: Suralle, led by Anya Suralle. The Suralles have a good thing going right now and don't want the war they can sense is coming, so they remain a solid Merrane ally.

7: Zevanne, led by Omi Zevane. The Zevannes re working hard to get into a stronger position mainly to protect themselves from bullying from the top houses, who are trying to intimidate the smaller houses into alliances against Merrane.

8: Summane, led by Prama Summane. The Summanes are embroiled in a private clandestine war against the breakaway house of Starenne, which was originally part of Summane.

9: Starenne, led by Koya Starenne. The Starennes are fighting for the lives against the relentless war waged by the larger house of Summane, and will ally themselves with anyone that can get the Summanes off their back.

10: Malinne, led by Alisha Malinne. The Malinnes control border territory and don't want war. They are in secret talks with the five races of the Alliance for admission into the Alliance if civil war breaks out, for they intend to break away if it happens.

11: Seldarre, led by Mura Seldarre. A small house with no real amibitions. Mura Seldarre is almost infamous within the Siann for her militant disregard for intrigue.

12: Varinne, led by Dani Varinne. With only three small planets under their control, the Varinnes are basicly ignored by the other Highborns as irrelevent. Their only claim to any kind of power is their blood relation to the Empress.

The Minor Houses

There are 31 minor houses ranging in power from the formidable Ayalles, who control 4 star systems, to the newly restored house of Karinne, who does not even have a home planet of their own. Two houses, the house of Gzann and thehouse of Pzurr, are Makati houses. The newly reformed house of Karinne is a Terran house.

The Minor Houses, ranked by power:

Ayalle
Stravenne
Trefani
Sandalle
Dayenne
Sanani
Rynn
Jalanne
Aenay
Tudrinne
Seppi
Denalle
Ziralle
Murri
Yin
Stralla
Colana
Shandalle
Jyrinne
Saenne
Gzann (Makati house)
Imarre
Hayanne
Manne
Cevenne
Sirri
Vupenne
Sheyonne
Shekki
Pzurr (Makati house)
Karinne (Terran house)

[Mizriath]

Thank you so much Fel. Well the insight helps me clear out some of the politics of the current Imperium.

And she some light that the Faey are not bloody murderers to kill off the previous rulers once toppled in the Third civil War.

Miz.

[Fel]

The only reason Shovalle still exists is because they surrendered and gave up virtually the entire holdings of their house. It took them a thousand years of wise and careful leadership by capable Grand Duchesses to rebuild to where they were a viable force in the Imperium again.

When Faey make war, they are both extremely violent and highly vindictive. The Shovalles were the only house to lose the throne without being destroyed. Usually, the house IS completely wiped out, to make absolutely certain no future house member would rise up and try to claim the throne. The Shovalles signed a treaty that surrendered their holdings and forbade them from sitting on the Highborn Council for 1,000 years, which effectively locked them out of any kind of power. They've been back on the council for a few centuries now, and the other houses of the Highborns walk very carefully around them. Dorrane might be the biggest, and Trillane the militarily strongest, but the Shovalles are the smartest.

[Spec8472]

Hehehe, *evil chuckles*

Fel, this is great material, but it's like throwing berlei into the ocean - you're just going to get us all worked up for another Subjugation-universe book/story/etc

[Mizriath]

Ooh Fel.

You had prepared and write all these background notes for the Subjugation universe to keep the whole story linked up and tied together and not use it.

I guess it could be the backgorund info for the other short stories. Especially on how a noble house is created besides being a breakaway.

And proof the BLOODthirsty and violent Faey can have compassion if it benefits them. And they are all BLOOD related and they intermarry into each other's houses to keep up their snotty uppity noses and BLOOD relations from getting too diluted. And intermarry they must to

Hmm, I believe the minor houses are also allied to the Highborns since there 4 houses that are vying for the throne. So the minor houses that wants to behave like highborns would definitely ally themseves to the top 5 highborns.

The Starenne will be among the first Highborn to propose alliance.

I wonder how many alliance marriages Jason can accept, and whether Dahnai herself will intervene to put a stop to it. Jyslin will have to make Dahnai a friend to help her put off all the marriage proposals.

Miz

[Mizriath]

Oops. I hope Fel does not regret opening this can of sardinnes..

[Fel]

Ooh Fel.

You had prepared and write all these background notes for the Subjugation universe to keep the whole story linked up and tied together and not use it.

Wrong.

One of the rules of writing is that the reader only sees about 25% of the work the writer does. I do a LOT of backstory work like this, that way I have everything all organized when it comes time to write. Something I might just mention in passing, only once, may represent two hours of work as I carefully fleshed in the history, etc.

If anything, I didn't do half as much backstory work in Subjugation as I should have. I wasn't taking the book seriously for the first ten chapters, basicly just screwing around with it in a literary sense, writing without plan or form in a freestyle manner, so when the time came that I realized I could make something of it, I had this chaotic unconnected mess that I had to go back through and kinda engineer into a viable plot just using the blurbs and tidbits I laced through the earlier chapters. That's why the story seems to suddenly pick up a focus and move in a set direction come chapter 11.

So there, there's my dirty little secret. Subjugation started as an amusing distraction from writing the Sennadar books, but then suddenly turned into a book of its own...that I grew pretty fond of.

When I finish Subjugation, I WILL be going back and editing the early chapters to more attune them to the book's ending.

[Mizriath]

Ooh Fel.

You had prepared and write all these background notes for the Subjugation universe to keep the whole story linked up and tied together and not use it.

Wrong.

One of the rules of writing is that the reader only sees about 25% of the work the writer does. I do a LOT of backstory work like this, that way I have everything all organized when it comes time to write. Something I might just mention in passing, only once, may represent two hours of work as I carefully fleshed in the history, etc.

If anything, I didn't do half as much backstory work in Subjugation as I should have. I wasn't taking the book seriously for the first ten chapters, basicly just screwing around with it in a literary sense, writing without plan or form in a freestyle manner, so when the time came that I realized I could make something of it, I had this chaotic unconnected mess that I had to go back through and kinda engineer into a viable plot just using the blurbs and tidbits I laced through the earlier chapters. That's why the story seems to suddenly pick up a focus and move in a set direction come chapter 11.

So there, there's my dirty little secret. Subjugation started as an amusing distraction from writing the Sennadar books, but then suddenly turned into a book of its own...that I grew pretty fond of.

When I finish Subjugation, I WILL be going back and editing the early chapters to more attune them to the book's ending.

Arrrgh.. I got shot down. It hurts. I owe Fel a box of cookies.

Hey but I was not that wrong. Well but in exams, a bit wrong is still wrong especially if the numbers used in applying the formula is wrong.

Well you can continue finding distractions to write, and I will still read.

You still have a fan here.

Miz

[RobJ]

Fel one point that I hope you can clarify for me. Myleena who is from House Merrane and therefore I assume blood related to the Empress has now become part of House Karinne. Would this not give House Karinne greater standing within the order of houses? Forgive me if I have it wrong as I haven't gone back to the relevant chapter to clarify the point before asking the question.

[Astardis]

Fel one point that I hope you can clarify for me. Myleena who is from House Merrane and therefore I assume blood related to the Empress has now become part of House Karinne. Would this not give House Karinne greater standing within the order of houses? Forgive me if I have it wrong as I haven't gone back to the relevant chapter to clarify the point before asking the question.

That's a mistake I made, too. But I thought about it a bit and came to the conclusion, that not all nobles within a house are bloodrelated. Just think about it. Fel stated earlier that it is quite possible to marry inside of your own house. So even if incest isn't forbitten, the possibility of birth/gene defects by interbreeding is quite possible. So I am sure, alot of Merrane nobles, mostly the lower ones aren't necessarily bloodrelated to the empress.
Myleena was one of the lowest nobles before joining the forces so her connection to the empress is probably to thin.

Astardis

[Fel]

Fel one point that I hope you can clarify for me. Myleena who is from House Merrane and therefore I assume blood related to the Empress has now become part of House Karinne. Would this not give House Karinne greater standing within the order of houses? Forgive me if I have it wrong as I haven't gone back to the relevant chapter to clarify the point before asking the question.

That's a mistake I made, too. But I thought about it a bit and came to the conclusion, that not all nobles within a house are bloodrelated. Just think about it. Fel stated earlier that it is quite possible to marry inside of your own house. So even if incest isn't forbitten, the possibility of birth/gene defects by interbreeding is quite possible. So I am sure, alot of Merrane nobles, mostly the lower ones aren't necessarily bloodrelated to the empress.
Myleena was one of the lowest nobles before joining the forces so her connection to the empress is probably to thin.

Astardis

Guys...these houses are HUGE, with tens of thousands of nobles on the average. And not every noble in the house is originally part of the founding family. Many of the houses awarded commoners with noble titles, and they became part of the house. Once you get past the ruling family, a noble house has plenty of genetic diversity.

There are tremendously diverse bloodlines within the houses. It is very easy to marry within the house without marrying a close relative.

The only nobles in the houses that are careful about the bloodline's "purity" are the ruling families, who have to maintain that blood relation to the throne. So they only tend to marry nobles with a high pedigree, like nobles from families who are able to trace their bloodlines to prove their noble lineage.

[Fiferguy]

Which brings back my point about how truly weak Jason's house is right now, in reference to numbers. It wouldn't take much to hunt down Jason's house and destroy Karinne for good.

[Astardis]

That somehow reminds me of the nobility of england. Those nobles waging their selfimportance on their placement in the throne succession. There are nobles who are proud to be no. 112th as heirs or so.

I can understand why Jason has problems with them.

[Lochar]

That somehow reminds me of the nobility of england. Those nobles waging their selfimportance on their placement in the throne succession. There are nobles who are proud to be no. 112th as heirs or so.

I can understand why Jason has problems with them.

You have to remember, the line Jason traced his lineage through was what, number 237 or so in line for just the House title?

Yeah, they were a little obsessed with bloodline tracing.