Revolution Chapter 10 (Spoilers)

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Not a ID
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Revolution Chapter 10 (Spoilers)

Post by Not a ID » Wed Dec 25, 2019 6:43 pm

So, even the FMS version of the Virus mutated, the Urumi are becoming Generations by way of that strain at present. That the FMS strain did adapt to the Urumi suggests that mutations are likely to start happening on Earth and possibly even Draconis in the near-ish future, "critical mass" just hasn't been achieved just yet. (Its also possible Draconis doesn't have enough of the other non-imperial races for it to "jump" to another species, but I'd expect the Makati, Kizzik, and company to become infected as well before the clock runs down in the Imperium.

The Karis version has escaped containment and infected the Kirri due to the symbiotes, two additional empires now have samples of the Karis Strain, they just haven't decided to use it.

Tir Tairngire is now confirmed as infected, the Wolves can now be easily communicated with by Generations through commune. There were others living with or visiting the Dreamers when the outbreak happened who are not House members as well. Those guests of the Dreamers now have some decisions of their own to make. The twenty million Haumda on planet being the single biggest block, but I'm sure there's a prophecy or omen involved to guide them in regards to their situation. :wink:

A summit of Galactic Leaders is being called to discuss the ramifications of these events and how they want to proceed. Krazrou (the new Kirri leader) has suggested offering the various leaders a chance to become Generations. Which for reasons beyond the one Jason gave is probably a bad idea. If it's limited to a few species in general, and only leaders for the rest, that is potentially even worse than trying to keep the status quo as it is. Better to just convert the entire species than restrict being a Generation to "being part of the elite" as that just helps create the very thing Jason seeks to avoid.

But also as Earth is experiencing, converting whole planets at a time for a non-Faey race can be a very dodgy proposition due to the sheer number of new telepaths it creates. I'm still thinking deliberate infection by way of using the Benga super-ships is a more viable approach for intended "transitions" going forward.

It allows for near total control of who enters or exits the ship or just sections of it. It allows for a large population to be handled at once, but not an overwhelming one like many planetary populations would be. And if a lethal variant emerges, more options for controlling and containing it can be employed(possibly even preemptively) using airskin shields at the relevant ventilation ducts.

If nothing else, at least in some cases, it should be used for the "initial rounds" of such transitions to becoming Generations. As it allows for the controlled creation of a sufficient number of people belonging to that particular species/race becoming Generations and sufficiently trained that they are able to tackle converting an entire(semi-urban or more) planetary population in a single go without needing to resort to large-scale outside help like is happening on Terra.(The Skaa being a prime example because of their sheer numbers) Many races only have a low single-digit percentage of telepaths among their numbers, and in some cases, many of those left to join the Karrines so their already low numbers are even more depleted. So what happened on Terra is likely to be a strong indicator of what they'll experience, and possibly an optimistic form of it given Terra had the advantage of a substantial Imperial Marine presence before the outbreak, not to mention large populations of other telepathic aliens on world.

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Re: Revolution Chapter 10 (Spoilers)

Post by Not a ID » Wed Dec 25, 2019 7:36 pm

And there is the matter that the Dream hasn't changed for Aria, and the Dreamers haven't indicated others have shared it just yet. In the re-read, I did note a couple things. I now have three possible interpretations at hand now.

But to get the first, albeit one I find unlikely. We need to go back to when Aria first met Dahnai, in Conviction Chapter 14:
“Hello, pippy,” Dahnai said in an instantly tender voice, the voice of a mother.  “It’s nice to meet you.”
Aria gave her a long look, then gasped.  “It’s you!  The other face from my dream!” she blurted.
“I am?  What did you see in your dream, pippy?” Dahnai asked seriously.
“You’re the Valkyrie!” she said.  “The woman in golden armor riding the dragon!”
“My, that sounds impressive,” she said, leaning over a bit.  “And what do I do in your dream?”
“You have your dragon eat the giant,” she replied.
Remember, most of her visions are part of a dream, they’re couched in metaphor and symbol, Jason warned privately.  “Is it a good thing or a bad thing that her dragon eats the giant?”
“It’s a good thing,” she replied, looking at him.  “The giant was about to step on a village, but her dragon eats it before it does.”
Jason put that together quickly.  It was a stark warning to him that he needed Dahnai’s help to save the Dreamers.  The dragon had to be her Navy, and the giant the Syndicate.  “Well, then, it’s a good thing I’m here,” Dahnai smiled.
“Mah.  You’re like Jason and Jyslin,” she said, pointing at Jason.  “I know you from my dream, just like I know them.  I know you’re nice.”
“You’ve seen me in your dreams, sweetling?” Jyslin asked.
“Mah, but I didn’t recognize you at first, because you wear a mask in my dream,” she answered.  “But I figured it out.”
“What does she do in your dream?” Jason asked.
Aria sniffled a bit.  “She loves me and takes care of me, like my own mother would have,” she said.
Jyslin’s eyes just melted, and she collected up Aria in her arms.  “That already came true, my sweetling,” she cooed to her. “I already love you.”
Well, that certainly explained to Jason why Aria warmed up to Jyslin so fast.  She must have seen her in her visions, Jason’s wife and her foster mother.  But why the mask?  That seemed unusual, and it also seemed strangely important.  “Do you know why she was wearing a mask in your dream, Aria?” Jason asked.
“Neh,” she answered, which was her word for no.  “I take the mask off in my dream, I just don’t remember what’s behind it.  She just smiles at me and puts it back on and tells me that I’ll understand when I’m older.”
Jyslin's Mask in that instance was probably a reference her own transition to being a Generation, which hadn't happened at the time of that meeting, but plans were already in motion. Now that Aria is older, and also a Generation, the mask has been removed, and she can understand the reason for the deception. But it hints at the possibility that if Jyslin's becoming a Generation in that dream is connected to the current dream. Of course, with that interpretation, there's a problem with "the dragon" in her recent dream being the Medical service, at least if you presume the two visions are connected to each other.

But it is entirely possible the two dreams are not connected at all and the specifics of the metaphor used in one doesn't mean it applies to the other. IE Just because she saw a dragon as representing one thing in one vision, doesn't mean that every time she sees a dragon in a vision from then on, it means that thing is involved. Rather it may just be that a dragon indicates a large, powerful entity/group/thing with the ability to cause significant damage or change.

I still favor the medical service being at issue this time around though. Revolution chapter 5 brings us both the introduction to the dream:
She keeps dreaming about a village being burned to the ground by a dragon. You and Mom are in the dream, you try to fight the dragon, but the dream always ends before she learns what happens to you. She said the last thing she sees in the dream before it ends is you and Dahnai jumping from the back of winged animals with swords in your hands, hurling yourself at the dragon’s face as if you’re going to try to kill it. But she doesn’t know what happens, or what it even means. She’s not sure if she should tell you or not, because she doesn’t know if the outcome is good or bad. Since she doesn’t understand what the dream means, she’s afraid to say anything, that if she makes the wrong decision, you and Mom will get hurt because of it.
And shortly after that discussion, Jason is briefed on Kevin Ball by Cyvanne, something which Cyvanne had been aware of for a couple of days, but more particularly while Aria had been having the dream for "several nights." The event that really caught Cyvanne's attention had occurred 5 days earlier.

Which would indicate Aria probably started having the dreams shortly after Kevin's fight happened which set the dominoes in motion for Cyvanne to find the camera footage of the fight, and for Cyvanne to notify Jason.That in turn drew their attention the FMS and what it had been up to with regards to the Farm Workers(which could connect the metaphorical destroyed village back to the Subjugation--maybe even Charleston? But that only works if this Dragon is the Faey Military, which doesn't work well IMO.

Or the more likely form is that the village being burned to the ground might be a metaphor for the release of the retrovirus and "not being able to go back" from that because everything has changed as a consequence. You can't go home again because "home" in the form of the Village has been destroyed. Which leads us to interpretations #2 and #3. Interpretation #2 remains that the Dragon is the FMS. However, Interpretation #3 is that the Dragon is the Retrovirus itself, and the chain of events caused by Kevin Ball made the retrovirus release inevitable.

Then we get to Chapter 8 (12 August 2022):
Truth be told, the last month or so, once they’d dropped the hammer on the DFM for embezzling the money meant for the farm survivors, he’d had plenty of time to work on his rating. Outside of the whole Medical Service thing and the distraction of Zach’s betrothal to Dara, things had been fairly quiet. The Kimdori still hadn’t broken into Ward Six, despite a lack of trying…which had become something of a holy crusade for Zaa now. She was going to crack their security even if she had to level the annex with an antimatter bomb. Since there was nothing he could really do about that but wait, it gave him time to work on rigger training once he finished the paperwork that came with his day job.

Well, there was one thing that was different, and he’d been thinking about it most of the day. Aria’s dream had changed.

It was still mostly the same. He and Dahnai were fighting a dragon, but before, when the dream would end before she knew what happened, last night, she had seen more of it. When, in the dream, he and Dahnai hurl themselves at the dragon holding swords to kill it, the dream would end before they struck any blows. But last night, she’d seen the dragon swipe down Dahnai with its paw, sending her plummeting towards the ground, while Jason drove his sword into its upper neck, which made it roar in pain. But the dream ended before she saw if the blow killed the dragon, or if the dragon struck him down in retaliation for the blow.
It also was the day that the retrovirus went "active" so another choice had been made likely in the crossroads dream Aria was having as per Chapter 6:
“Not every prediction follows a set path, your Grace,” Elder Kalu told him, her dark hair bouncing a bit as she bobbed her head. “What Aria describes is a choice that must be made, and without that choice, then there is no path for her to follow to see what happens next. This kind of prediction is not unheard of, but it is fairly rare. We call it a Crossroads Prophecy, a prophecy that warns of something momentous in the future, but whose ultimate conclusion is in doubt because no decision has been made to influence its direction.”

“What it means is that the future Aria sees cannot be predicted because there are two or more equally prescient paths that the future can take,” Elder Rovak said, the large man nearly a head over the other four Elders as they sat at the table. He was the oldest of the five, but also the largest and most spry. “As we near the events of her dream, its content may change if one of those choices becomes more likely than the others. But until that happens, your Grace, I regret to say that there is little that can be done. No other Dreamer has reported an omen dream similar to hers, so we don’t have a second opinion in the matter.”

“It is both a prophecy and an omen, your Grace,” Elder Vado said. “But until she sees more, or her dream changes, it’s an equal possibility of which it becomes.”
Nothing has changed in the dream since the outbreak as it pertains to the Medical Service. So the second interpretation currently has nowhere to go right now, no action has been taken in regards to the role the FMS played in releasing the Virus, and no actions are being discussed.

But if you instead make the virus the dragon, on the day of it becoming active, both Jason and Dahnai jumped into action to take steps to contain it. Dahnai's attempt was far less successful(swatted out of the air), and she quickly ends up letting the retrovirus run its course, where it subsequently mutates and infects/transitions the Urumi Collective as well. While Jason's attack on the Dragon meets slightly better success, although it too broke containment and infected every Karrine holding and even the Karri, but it appears to be locked down at the moment, just not fully under his control. The Jirunji and Subrians have it and could use it, but they do have it locked down in a non-contagious state for now.

Jason is now in a position where he can "end it" with a head strike(having the Kimdori locate the samples so they can be destroyed), or he can pursue another option he hadn't considered previously. If that interpretation holds, he's now hit "the crossroad" for Aria's Dream, and at least Aria, if not other dreamers, are likely to be experiencing some new dreams either "tonight" storywise, or after their impromptu summit on Oasis.

The other aspect of the "village" metaphor in the context of the dragon being the retrovirus, is that the "community of Generations" no longer is comprised of a "small village" worth of individuals numbering in the 200's. They now number in the tens of Billions and soon to be hundreds of Billions. "The village" is well and truly gone.

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Re: Revolution Chapter 10 (Spoilers)

Post by lapland » Wed Dec 25, 2019 7:39 pm

I seem to recall Jason had to go through a genetic alteration after visiting Moridon and catching the virus that was designed to kill any Kimdori that went there. How will the new Generations react the the atmosphere of Moridon being toxic to generations and will anyone come up with a new virus to wipe out the generations? Or possibly use the virus as a way to halt the transformation of the galaxy?

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Re: Revolution Chapter 10 (Spoilers)

Post by Not a ID » Wed Dec 25, 2019 7:54 pm

lapland wrote:
Wed Dec 25, 2019 7:39 pm
I seem to recall Jason had to go through a genetic alteration after visiting Moridon and catching the virus that was designed to kill any Kimdori that went there. How will the new Generations react the the atmosphere of Moridon being toxic to generations and will anyone come up with a new virus to wipe out the generations? Or possibly use the virus as a way to halt the transformation of the galaxy?
That one wasn't a genetic alteration, but he had to go through one of those(without his knowledge) as well.

The counter agent to the Moridon virus is now known after the Kimdori helped Songa, Rann, and another Faye doctor(forget her name ATM) "discover" the cure. Its a protein chain that I think can only be formed after being infected with the virus. There might be a way to vaccinate, in either case, I'm sure protocols will be put in place to guard against that issue becoming as dire for future Generations as it was for Jason. If anything, I suspect the Moridon would love nothing more than to jump at the chance to become Generations for the ability to split if nothing else. That would likely result in their undertaking an effort to scrub that agent from their planet, or to inoculate any Generation that comes calling as a courtesy part of being a Diamond Tier customer.

Having high value clients die shortly after visiting them is bad for business, everyone else can do their banking on Terra, Karis, or a few other Confederation Worlds no doubt.

As to the actual alteration he went through, well, I guess we'll see what happens with the Humans in particular over the coming years.

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Re: Revolution Chapter 10 (Spoilers)

Post by Dreamer » Thu Dec 26, 2019 2:53 pm

Not a ID wrote:
Wed Dec 25, 2019 7:54 pm
lapland wrote:
Wed Dec 25, 2019 7:39 pm
I seem to recall Jason had to go through a genetic alteration after visiting Moridon and catching the virus that was designed to kill any Kimdori that went there. How will the new Generations react the the atmosphere of Moridon being toxic to generations and will anyone come up with a new virus to wipe out the generations? Or possibly use the virus as a way to halt the transformation of the galaxy?
That one wasn't a genetic alteration, but he had to go through one of those(without his knowledge) as well.

The counter agent to the Moridon virus is now known after the Kimdori helped Songa, Rann, and another Faye doctor(forget her name ATM) "discover" the cure. Its a protein chain that I think can only be formed after being infected with the virus. There might be a way to vaccinate, in either case, I'm sure protocols will be put in place to guard against that issue becoming as dire for future Generations as it was for Jason. If anything, I suspect the Moridon would love nothing more than to jump at the chance to become Generations for the ability to split if nothing else. That would likely result in their undertaking an effort to scrub that agent from their planet, or to inoculate any Generation that comes calling as a courtesy part of being a Diamond Tier customer.

Having high value clients die shortly after visiting them is bad for business, everyone else can do their banking on Terra, Karis, or a few other Confederation Worlds no doubt.

As to the actual alteration he went through, well, I guess we'll see what happens with the Humans in particular over the coming years.
That made me think: what happens when the Moridani become Generations and their planets (or at least their home planet) is/are already seeded with the anti-Kimdori virus? Do they go into a coma for the brain changes only to never wake up again as the anti-Kimdori virus goes into effect?

I agree with the comment about waiting and seeing what happens to the new Human Generations. The issue was described as needing to be addressed for all (totaling less than five I think) human Generations initially. Will the new converts need to be “fixed” as well to prevent cancer or will the new viral outbreak already include the current “stable” form of Generation DNA that Jason possesses?

Next question. There is a minimal Karrine presence in Andromeda working in the transport (and info gathering) enterprise - will the Benga (or maybe it’s Bengali, or Bengan, or Bengals) become Generations?

On the list of ”WTF was that?” options for Generation transformations: Oye trees, the Kimdori (they finally get to experience true merges, and TK), the Tabbi (Spelling?) cats, Rann’s pet/minder fox (sorry don’t remember the species or critter’s name).

Now for the real question I want answered: How are the ex-farm workers in Terra coping with becoming Generations. And now there are plans for them to be trained not only by Faey, but by Faey teaching the classes using telepathy. Can anyone else say instant ’Schism with deadly consequences’?

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Re: NOT Revolution Chapter 10 (Spoilers)

Post by Dreamer » Thu Dec 26, 2019 3:09 pm

Sorry for posting this here, but the thread where this belongs is locked. Is the SpellDancer story now defunct, being re-evaluated, on prolonged hiatus, or under some other category?

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Revolution Chapter 10 (Spoilers)

Post by Fel » Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:17 pm

Dreamer wrote:
Thu Dec 26, 2019 3:09 pm
Sorry for posting this here, but the thread where this belongs is locked. Is the SpellDancer story now defunct, being re-evaluated, on prolonged hiatus, or under some other category?
I may pick it up again, I may not. But it's not currently being actively worked on.
Just another guy from the shallow end of the gene pool.

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Re: Revolution Chapter 10 (Spoilers)

Post by Not a ID » Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:50 pm

Dreamer wrote:
Thu Dec 26, 2019 2:53 pm
That made me think: what happens when the Moridani become Generations and their planets (or at least their home planet) is/are already seeded with the anti-Kimdori virus? Do they go into a coma for the brain changes only to never wake up again as the anti-Kimdori virus goes into effect?
Interesting point, from how I recall that virus works, it would probably start killing them as soon as they woke up. The Moridon Virus is basically an auto-immune disease that attacks Generation DNA. As the immune system is shut down while they transition to becoming Generations, that should keep them safe from any auto-immune diseases until after it allows the immune system to reactivate. But to be safe, if you're on that world and infected with the retrovirus, doctors probably should be pre-emptively treating you for the Moridon Virus just to be safe.
I agree with the comment about waiting and seeing what happens to the new Human Generations. The issue was described as needing to be addressed for all (totaling less than five I think) human Generations initially. Will the new converts need to be “fixed” as well to prevent cancer or will the new viral outbreak already include the current “stable” form of Generation DNA that Jason possesses?
It was much less than 5, there were only 2 ("fully") Human Generations at the time the issue was presented. Their children were safe from encountering brain damage while merged because their neural pathways took after their Faey parents rather than their human one.

I touched on it in the Chapter 9 spoiler thread. Dahnai is ostensibly the source for the FMS version of the retrovirus. Dahnai in turn had been infected with a retrovirus from her daughter with Kellin. Her daughter in turn had been infected with the retrovirus by her fraternal twin fathered by Jason. The pregnancy was conceived months before Jason was diagnosed as having brain damage from using the biogenic merge with Cybi. When Jason was treated, the "fix" would only be inherited by his subsequent children, should they even need it due to being part Faey.

Also the fix greatly increased his cancer risk, rather than decrease it. I strongly suspect that "fix" is why the Karis version(which has Jason's genetic "fingerprints") mutated when he encountered it. So presumably the humans who were infected with the Karis strain have a significantly increased cancer risk compared to an already high risk factor Human Generations had to start with, but also have no risk of brain damage using biogenic merge capability. If anything, given the nature of "the fix" everyone(not just Humans) infected with the Karis strain is likely to be highly resilient against brain damage in general, as it will try to regrow damaged pathways, something the FMS strain won't do.

On further reflection, given the symbiotes are transporting fully formed viral cells around. I have to wonder if every generation on Karis, not just the new ones, has received "the fix" and will demonstrate comparable traits going forward... And how long it takes before a Karrine house member (or a Kirri) suffers a Brain Injury where it gets noticed.
Next question. There is a minimal Karrine presence in Andromeda working in the transport (and info gathering) enterprise - will the Benga (or maybe it’s Bengali, or Bengan, or Bengals) become Generations?
My understanding is that the "in person" presence is essentially limited to Prakka. They may have scouts poking around, but they don't leave the ship. Beyond that, any other interactions they're having with Benga are presumably other comms, or with Bionoids.
On the list of ”WTF was that?” options for Generation transformations: Oye trees, the Kimdori (they finally get to experience true merges, and TK), the Tabbi (Spelling?) cats, Rann’s pet/minder fox (sorry don’t remember the species or critter’s name).


Oye trees completely lack the physiology to be transformed, and given the Parri themselves seem to be the only other ones immune to the transformation, I doubt the trees about to start talking over biogenic commune.

The Kimdori likewise are immune to the retrovirus because the relevant DNA came from them, and the whole matter that the Kimdori are a viral agent. The Tabbis and the Vulpars don't have an advanced enough brain structure to be changed by the virus, and given how quickly the version on Karis mutated to include basically every sentient race on the planet, if it hasn't done so by the end of Chapter 10, (12 August when it was detected, 19 September at the end of Chapter 10) it probably won't.
Now for the real question I want answered: How are the ex-farm workers in Terra coping with becoming Generations. And now there are plans for them to be trained not only by Faey, but by Faey teaching the classes using telepathy. Can anyone else say instant ’Schism with deadly consequences’?
It actually would be mildly unsurprising to discover most of the schisms experienced on Terra involved former farm workers. But you also need to remember that while Faey comprised most of the active telepath population on Earth on August 12th, they were not the only Telepaths living on Terra. The Academy has telepaths from all over the Galaxy in attendance, and as the Confederacy is basically headquartered on Terra there are a lot more telepathic races present in numbers either to staff Confederate administrative/military positions, or staffing business offices given Terra is a very significant trade hub for the Confederacy.

With that in mind, there are a large number of non-Faey available for giving instruction on telepathy. But given the importance of being able to close their minds--and the significance of being able to even do so. I think most former Farm Workers won't be overly picky about who instructs them on that. Now for telepathy training beyond that? That's an entirely different matter.

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Re: Revolution Chapter 10 (Spoilers)

Post by lapland » Fri Dec 27, 2019 11:41 am

I also wonder what effect being a Generation has on former enemies? It seems all Generations have a special affinity with other Generations and possibly genetically dislikes bringing harm to other Generations. It’s true there is no alteration in how they treat other non Generations. But they don’t seem to intentionally bring harm to each other. So former enemies could become friends. And Jason could become the father of the Generations and therefore many will abide by his rules of Generations. Besides the CBIMs can trace every Generation in the known universe now that they have placed the relay stations ou there.

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Re: Revolution Chapter 10 (Spoilers)

Post by jeffreyC » Mon Dec 30, 2019 2:40 am

Fleet Commander Au Mai Sha Ra is still locked up in a space station prison for telepathic inmates orbiting Luna.
The quarantine of that needs to be secure.
Out of all the Benga in the known universe she does not make the cut for the first billion I would want to become a Generation.

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Re: Revolution Chapter 10 (Spoilers)

Post by Not a ID » Mon Dec 30, 2019 3:16 am

Hopefully full decontamination protocols have been in use there, so the Imperial Marines working at the facility have been in self-contained armor anytime they've been sharing environmental systems with the prisoners. But we could be mistaken. At least, assuming the last shift change/rotation didn't happen until after the outbreak was known about. Food supply for the prisoners might be a might more challenging though.

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Re: Revolution Chapter 10 (Spoilers)

Post by GotToGo » Mon Dec 30, 2019 8:04 pm

A Vaccine might be useful, i.e. Polio? Outdated tech still has some useful applications. :)

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Re: Revolution Chapter 10 (Spoilers)

Post by Not a ID » Mon Dec 30, 2019 11:28 pm

What sapient race, aside from the Pari, would want to be vaccinated against possibly becoming a Generation at some point in the future?

That and Fel has already covered in story why a vaccine hasn't happened, and basically why work on one has stopped.

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Re: Revolution Chapter 10 (Spoilers)

Post by Wolfee » Thu Jan 02, 2020 3:55 am

Not a ID wrote:
Mon Dec 30, 2019 11:28 pm
What sapient race, aside from the Pari, would want to be vaccinated against possibly becoming a Generation at some point in the future?

That and Fel has already covered in story why a vaccine hasn't happened, and basically why work on one has stopped.
One whose religion described such powers as coming from the "devil" for example.

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Re: Revolution Chapter 10 (Spoilers)

Post by Not a ID » Fri Jan 03, 2020 11:48 pm

Wolfee wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 3:55 am
Not a ID wrote:
Mon Dec 30, 2019 11:28 pm
What sapient race, aside from the Pari, would want to be vaccinated against possibly becoming a Generation at some point in the future?

That and Fel has already covered in story why a vaccine hasn't happened, and basically why work on one has stopped.
One whose religion described such powers as coming from the "devil" for example.
The only group that claimed such a position was the Consortium, but it was a propoganda claim made to try to rally others against the Karrines. The Kimdori haven't mentioned anyone who is actually so inclined, and I'd think they'd be known about as potential long term threats to the House Karrine otherwise. Doubly so now that there is a retro-virus making new Generations by the billions.

Otherwise, it's a bunch of people being paranoid about being left behind the on power curve if they don't become Generations.

Now that paranoia, in light of the outbreak, could very well result in such a religious movement getting some serious momentum behind them, but it's unlikely that any such organization exists at this time, certainly not at sufficient scale as to hold control of an inter-stellar nation.

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