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At various times in the sennadar books Fel has talked of Jasana's power. However he also talked of Spyder's power and how sheer raw power in sorcery is her unique Mishara ability, then we also read at some point that when the goddess fashioned Tarrin's new body she increased his aptitude for sorcery because she did not like the idea of him being eclipsed by his daughter. So now the question becomes:

In terms of sheer raw power in sorcery discounting skill and experience who is the strongest: Tarrin, Jasana or Spyder?

afrigeek wrote:At various times in the sennadar books Fel has talked of Jasana's power. However he also talked of Spyder's power and how sheer raw power in sorcery is her unique Mishara ability, then we also read at some point that when the goddess fashioned Tarrin's new body she increased his aptitude for sorcery because she did not like the idea of him being eclipsed by his daughter. So now the question becomes:

In terms of sheer raw power in sorcery discounting skill and experience who is the strongest: Tarrin, Jasana or Spyder?

I'd have to say Tarrin is, with Spyder next and Jasana last, because they are Mishara's it gives them a much bigger advantage.

think Hearly, hit it on the head. though its got to be at least two years , since I last visited tarrins world.

Hearly wrote:

afrigeek wrote:At various times in the sennadar books Fel has talked of Jasana's power. However he also talked of Spyder's power and how sheer raw power in sorcery is her unique Mishara ability, then we also read at some point that when the goddess fashioned Tarrin's new body she increased his aptitude for sorcery because she did not like the idea of him being eclipsed by his daughter. So now the question becomes:

In terms of sheer raw power in sorcery discounting skill and experience who is the strongest: Tarrin, Jasana or Spyder?

I'd have to say Tarrin is, with Spyder next and Jasana last, because they are Mishara's it gives them a much bigger advantage.

I'd have to disagree. I don't think the Goddess made Tarrin more powerful than Spyder, but I do believe he is just AS strong as her in terms of raw power after the Goddess brought him back. Spyder still has him by several thousand years experience, but Tarrin has always shown he had a natural aptitude for sorcery(at least once he learned how to use it properly). I'd say Tarrin and Spyder are probably about the same, with Jasana coming in a close third. Just my 2cents.

imthejman85 wrote:

Hearly wrote:

afrigeek wrote:At various times in the sennadar books Fel has talked of Jasana's power. However he also talked of Spyder's power and how sheer raw power in sorcery is her unique Mishara ability, then we also read at some point that when the goddess fashioned Tarrin's new body she increased his aptitude for sorcery because she did not like the idea of him being eclipsed by his daughter. So now the question becomes:

In terms of sheer raw power in sorcery discounting skill and experience who is the strongest: Tarrin, Jasana or Spyder?

I'd have to say Tarrin is, with Spyder next and Jasana last, because they are Mishara's it gives them a much bigger advantage.

I'd have to disagree. I don't think the Goddess made Tarrin more powerful than Spyder, but I do believe he is just AS strong as her in terms of raw power after the Goddess brought him back. Spyder still has him by several thousand years experience, but Tarrin has always shown he had a natural aptitude for sorcery(at least once he learned how to use it properly). I'd say Tarrin and Spyder are probably about the same, with Jasana coming in a close third. Just my 2cents.

i dont think we talk about pure sorcery power
but all their powers combined
in thet case the power level from high to low will be
Tarrin-->Spyder-->Jasana

Tarrin- knows and can use all the orders of magic and extremely powerful in all of them and in extreme cases capable to combine all of them
Spyder- probably knows only sorcery (and maybe a bit priest magic) but is immeasurably powerful and expirianced with it
Jasana- capable of using sorcery and druidic magic very powerful but unexperienced

Hearly wrote: I'd have to say Tarrin is, with Spyder next and Jasana last, because they are Mishara's it gives them a much bigger advantage.

Well of course with the Mishara ability to rewrite the rules of the universe they have a bigger advantage. However ceteris paribus...if we were to talk about purely raw power in sorcery, who has the most power?

it seems obvious to some that Tarrin and Spyder should have more power but the fact that entropy saw fit to create a Mishara (Eron) just to deal with Jasana makes you wonder how much power she actually has since one would expect that with beings as powerful as Tarrin, Spyder, Triana, Sapphire around, one would not need a new Mishara just to deal with a threat Jasana may pose to the entire world.

Afterall Grand Syllis with his circle of ancients showed us that even a circle of sufficiently powerful D'ashar can actually cut off a weavespinner from the weave as they did to Tarrin on the island.

Didn't the gog say that Spyder had the most raw power? Tarrin isn't powerful so much as he has a lot of will power. That makes him a match for more powerful beings, the fact that her refuses to lose.

I would probably say Spyder has the most raw power, followed by Tarrin and then his daughter. However I would point out that while there might be a significant amount of power differing those three, compared to their full power going all out its probably not all that much so skill plays a huge part of a confrontation. A pure slugging match with the power of sorcery would go as I mentioned, but a true battle, Spyder would win thanks to her years of experience but Tarrin would do a LOT better thanks to his intuitive grasp of sorcery.

Jasana wins in blunt raw power between the three. In terms of usable power, Tarrin wins. All he has to do is rage and suddenly he's pulling in more power than possible, or mixing raw energies from 4 schools of magic and his divinity(when he had it) into a massive chaotic blast. Sorry, Spyder.

But that's not 'usable' power anymore, its going all out pulling in outside magical abilities into equation (Tarrin's ability as a being of Entrophy). More to the point Spyder laughs at the ability and uses her mastery of space to step to the side or something.

usable power has to to a degree take in skill into account and to put it bluntly Spyder has forgotten more about efficient energy control than nearly every other magical user on Sennadar has ever known. At that leve lof power just efficency would put her as the top dog for a long long while.

Dingo wrote:Jasana wins in blunt raw power between the three. In terms of usable power, Tarrin wins. All he has to do is rage and suddenly he's pulling in more power than possible, or mixing raw energies from 4 schools of magic and his divinity(when he had it) into a massive chaotic blast. Sorry, Spyder.

Hmm, I doubt this for many reasons.. primarily something I remember where it is mentioned that when the goddess built Tarrin's new body, she increased his ability in sorcery to match Jasana's. However at the same time we are told that Spyder's specific Mishara trait apart from the ones common to all other Mishara is her raw power in sorcery which would tend to imply that it possibly exceeds Tarrin whose primary Mishara gift is will power. In addition the length of time spyder has been around watching magic grow, etc she probably knows more about priest magic than even the current high priests of various god and the same can probably be said of Wizard magic since as being technically immortal she is not subject to the rules that restrict mortals to one order of magic.

Belgarion213 wrote:But that's not 'usable' power anymore, its going all out pulling in outside magical abilities into equation (Tarrin's ability as a being of Entrophy). More to the point Spyder laughs at the ability and uses her mastery of space to step to the side or something.

usable power has to to a degree take in skill into account and to put it bluntly Spyder has forgotten more about efficient energy control than nearly every other magical user on Sennadar has ever known. At that leve lof power just efficency would put her as the top dog for a long long while.

Tarrin's ability as an agent of Entropy is pure willpower, allowing him to control power greater than normal. Also Spyder has some stupid cloak or something that has this portable hole effect. I wouldn't gauge Spyder or Tarrin's power on the items they've collected.

afrigeek wrote:Hmm, I doubt this for many reasons.. primarily something I remember where it is mentioned that when the goddess built Tarrin's new body, she increased his ability in sorcery to match Jasana's. However at the same time we are told that Spyder's specific Mishara trait apart from the ones common to all other Mishara is her raw power in sorcery which would tend to imply that it possibly exceeds Tarrin whose primary Mishara gift is will power. In addition the length of time spyder has been around watching magic grow, etc she probably knows more about priest magic than even the current high priests of various god and the same can probably be said of Wizard magic since as being technically immortal she is not subject to the rules that restrict mortals to one order of magic.

I'm re-reading the whole series right now, but I don't remember anything specific about Niami increasing his power to match Jasana. I think I remember she gave him a slight boost, and ofc when he was turned the second time he became more powerful by reaching more for the All during the transformation, which also increased his power in sorcery. Also, Spyder doesn't have full command of priest magic, as she can only use priest spells that don't have an equivalent in sorcery.

Dingo wrote: Tarrin's ability as an agent of Entropy is pure willpower, allowing him to control power greater than normal. Also Spyder has some stupid cloak or something that has this portable hole effect. I wouldn't gauge Spyder or Tarrin's power on the items they've collected.

Actually in addition they can rewrite the rules of the universe which is what allowed Spyder to imprison Val in his icon. She thought it was power granted to her by the elder gods but it was infact her entropic abilities.

Dingo wrote: I'm re-reading the whole series right now, but I don't remember anything specific about Niami increasing his power to match Jasana. I think I remember she gave him a slight boost, and ofc when he was turned the second time he became more powerful by reaching more for the All during the transformation, which also increased his power in sorcery. Also, Spyder doesn't have full command of priest magic, as she can only use priest spells that don't have an equivalent in sorcery.

I don't have the time to search through the chapters but I actually remember a specific instance where it states that Niami's sensibilities were a bit offended that Jasana had more power than Tarrin so she boosted him to match her. I think it was some conversation where they were talking about how much Niami seems to favour Tarrin.

Tarrin's powers were boosted when he was turned to were the second time (his close connection to sorcery allowed him to become a stronger druid, which resulted in him being stronger in sorcery). In addition, Niami tweaked it that time so that he would be on a comparable level to Jasana.

From memory she changed his body both times he lost one. After he was restored from the soul trap and his hair sample and when he returned to have his godly part of his soul removed. She makes a comment about not being happy that her champion isn't the most powerful the first time and gifts him that wings he uses to store sorcery and link back to Sennadar the second time.

As to who is the most powerful, does it matter as they're all at risk of destroying the world if they use their full power. Plus Jasana may be able to hold her own on Sennadar but off world she doesn't have sorcery, except where the elder god Tarrin is on Pyrosia, and using Druid magic is risky as an alien. She isn't mishara so she cannot change the rules of reality so I vote for Grandmother Wynn and her experience.