Shadow Walker Chapter 8 (Spoilers)

[miraborn]

I think Fel took pity on us and gave us that nice geography lesson So New York is a nuclear wasteland... Is that the city or the state? Implications that all of Noram was a single country? That is an interesting premise - Did the US take over Canada before the great war?

[afrigeek]

or possibly their knowledge of the history of the continent has some major gaps.

[Fel]

I think Fel took pity on us and gave us that nice geography lesson So New York is a nuclear wasteland... Is that the city or the state? Implications that all of Noram was a single country? That is an interesting premise - Did the US take over Canada before the great war?

The U.S, Canada, and Mexico merged early into the war to form a single nation, as China invaded Mexico as a means of gaining a land entry into America and also to capture the Panama Canal by cutting off land routes from the U.S. to Panama. Canada decided to join the new allied nation after they received intelligence that China intended to invade British Columbia to cut off land pipeline routes for oil from Alaska. So yes, virtually the entire continent of North America was all one nation.

New York City is the wasteland, but it wasn't nuked. A nearly nuclear plant was sabatoged and melted down. No nuclear missles were fired in the war.

[GBLW]

Canada decided to join the new allied nation after they received intelligence that China intended to invade British Columbia to cut off land pipeline routes for oil from Alaska.

I am willing to suspend my disbelief in reading your stories to accept arcans etc, but I simply cannot see any way in which most Canadians would willing give up their independence to become part of the US. However, if enough time passed, I suppose even that would be possible - eventually people might change that much. It's doubtful though, because it would require the changing of a whole nation's philosophy. At the present time the majority of Canadians are proud to be Canadian and have absolutely no desire to be citizens of the US of A.

Of course after saying that, then we would have to deal with the geography of the area and the physics of your proposition, which won't change in a few thousand years. Looking at that, the TransMountain Pipeline only comes near the Pacific Ocean as it nears Vancouver, BC. As for navigation to and from Vancouver, all the Chinese oil tankers would have to travel through the Juan de Fuca Strait. That means they would have to pass between Washington State and Vancouver Island, which would put them in waters easily defended by shore batteries which could easily be built in either the US or Canada. Coming around the north end of Vancouver Island would be impossible since large oil tankers simply wouldn't be able to maneuver through some of the passages in the Strait of Georgia. In fact some of the larger cruise ships have problems with those passages now and the largest of the present cruise ships are only half as long as a medium sized oil tanker. On top of that, the major oil and gas pipelines going to the US from Canadian oilfields run across the Canadian prairies and enter the US in the Great Lakes area.

In order for your idea to work, I would suspect that an invasion of all of western Canada would be required and that just might be difficult - even for the Chinese. As a rule, Canadians are polite and quiet, until cornered or offended, but then watch the fur fly.

(Just poking fun)

[lapland]

Perhaps it's not so much that Canada joined the US but rather the three countries making up the North American continent joined in a more formal version of a North American Trade pact. After New York gets wiped out, which would destroy the US econemy, and thus send the worlds econemy into a tailspen for a while anyway, the three countries could form a new country, based on their current ideals, but with common laws and military alliances throughout. The name United States of America was more discriptive of the form of government which our founders wanted rather then a collective name. Thus the new country may adopt the same or a similar name, or simply drop the United States part of the name altogether and collectively refer to it at America, which most from the US commonly refer to themselves even though all countries from Canada to the southern tip of South America could claim a right to.

Collectively we may need to unite into a single force to equip ourselves of protection against the single largest and possibly most powerful country in the world. There is really very little besides national pride that seperates the two largest nations of North America besides possibly the average division of our political spectrum. The average US citizen is still a little more conservative socially then the average Canadian from what I understand, although like any group individual differences vary greatly. But how far left will our country move if the center of government (Washington, DC is very close to New York City) is distroyed? How are right will Canadians move if their country is attacked by Communist China?

Although in our current political climate I really can't see the three nations joining into one, I do think there is a possibility. Besides, we still don't know if the war breaks our 20, 50, or 100 years from now. Perhaps we are far enough in the future that we are a space faring race and the need for political division is less a national pride then a continintal one. Do we know if "China" is the China of today, or is it an expanded country that takes up the entire continent it now is part of, or perhaps even more?

Overall this was an excellent story. Just wish it was longer.... Kyvin is becoming a very unstopable machine. To create an illusion that is so real that it effects the physical world around it. That is scarry. I'm just waiting for him to discover secrets of the shadow beasts that his totum doesn't understand, just like I'm waiting for same is subjegation universe. There are things in subspace that the Generations can sense that others can't. I'm convenced Fel has a reason for these things.

[Journeywoman]

Hey Fel,

I don't get as much time to peruse the forums as I used to but I'm loving this story. The novelist in me really needs to put in its 2c about this chapter though. To be blunt this was the first chapter that threw me out of your world. Again it was to do with the map scene. It felt fake. By this I mean you have told us in this scene that this is alternative future Earth but you have failed to show it in the last book and a half. What really threw me was what happened to the cities? The infrastructure? If it is alternate future Earth shouldn't Kyven be travelling bitchamin / concrete roads? Shouldn't there be dead or reinhabited cities? In all his travels he should have come across something. I also found everyone forgetting the war as a little far fetched.

My guess is that you decided to add this scene because some of the forum members guessed it was based off the USA. I've never been to the US so I would never have picked up on it. I was perfectly happy to believe it was an alternate world, which you pulled off well. I believe you would have to work a lot harder to pull off future alternate Earth.

On the above historical explination is you would need to improve it as per the comments already there and explain it fully like you were just forced to do. Alternatively you could leave it in mystery. I was happy enough with the explination you had given so far. You were hinting at more knowledge but were never explaining it. In the words of the Authors of Writing Excuses this is using smoke and mirrors. Explain something small in great depth and don't explain something big at all. You know it so you hint at it and you leave the readers wanting more. The way the book is set up proof it is Earth does not have to materialise. Your hints at a bigger history were interesting and sparked my curiousity. The explination fell flat.

The easiest way to fix this is to rewrite that scene so the map doesn't exist. Otherwise if you chose to keep it, I will say that I was left with the feeling of 'yet another authour using nukes.' It felt wrong because technology advanced enough to create Arcans, wouldn't another weapon have superceeded nukes? I understand now that it was a nuclear reactor but that would be a hard line to explain with the world as it is. Also shouldn't there be deformed generations of humans and arcans who live near there?

Well I'm getting down from my soapbox now. I hope this helps. Keep up the good work. I must admit you are doing very well for this basically being a published first draft. I have new respect for you after looking back at my most recent first draft :p.

[Fel]

The way I backstoried it was that the war happened in the mid 21st century, just 30 or 40 years from now. I imagined a war without nuclear weapons, as neither side was insane enough to actually use them because Russia made it abundantly clear that any nuclear exchange between China and America would cause them to launch against BOTH combatants. It was a conventional war that lasted well into the 22nd century, and ended with the Breach. The Breach was misconstrued by the world to be a nuclear attack, and after it happened, the rest of the world, which had remained neutral in the affair (Australia, South America, Europe and Africa), declared war on China and its allies and started World War 3. Until that time, it had been a war between China and a few allies against the continent of North America. When the rest of the world got involved, it ended with the entirety of civilization being shattered, Australia turned into a toxic wasteland due to Chinese chemical/biological attacks, and China being ultimately destroyed in the same manner they destroyed Australia. Chinese biological attacks aganst Australia triggered a global plague that swept the world, eradicated 70% of Earth's population, and effectively destroyed civilization.

The only true nuclear incident in the war was the meltdown of the Hudson Nuclear power plant, just outside New York City, which irradiated the entire New York metropolitan area. This happened BEFORE the war, and was the major catalyst that brought the war about, because it was clearly sabotage. America blamed China (who really did do it), China scoffed, and the gloves came off.

But China wasn't the only bad guy. North America (the name of the unified alliance formed againsts China, and the root of the current word "Noraam") perpetrated similar atrocities, discarding its nobility and resorting to doing anything to survive. The killing of North American citizens to create the Arcans was just one of many evil and ghastly acts perpetrated by the North American Alliance in its struggle against the Chinese.

The idea of futuristic weaponry was considered, and a few were developed, but given that this is a story about magic, that became the path both sides researched. The war attracted the spirits, caused them to again take note of the world, and that attention brought magic back to the world. The North Americans stumbled on it during weapons research, the Chinese stole the secrets using espionage, and I've already explained what happened after it was discovered. The Arcans were only one of various magic-based weapons created by both sides. It wasn't technology that created the Arcans, Journey, it was magic. They believed that it was technology, though, and in a way, it did require some quasi-technology to accomplish.

I like to leave that history intentionally vague and murky, and I won't completely explain it even here. Just take the general framework and fill in the gaps as you desire. That way, it becomes your story as much as mine.

[Fel]

Perhaps it's not so much that Canada joined the US but rather the three countries making up the North American continent joined in a more formal version of a North American Trade pact. After New York gets wiped out, which would destroy the US econemy, and thus send the worlds econemy into a tailspen for a while anyway, the three countries could form a new country, based on their current ideals, but with common laws and military alliances throughout. The name United States of America was more discriptive of the form of government which our founders wanted rather then a collective name. Thus the new country may adopt the same or a similar name, or simply drop the United States part of the name altogether and collectively refer to it at America, which most from the US commonly refer to themselves even though all countries from Canada to the southern tip of South America could claim a right to.

Generally yes. The three nations, Honduras, and Belize entered into the North American Alliance, where each country kept its own government, but created a council above them made up of the presidents and prime minister and two other officials that actually made most of the major decisions. It was more of a confederation than them merging into a single nation, but for all intents and purposes, they were a single entity.

[GBLW]

Generally yes. The three nations, Honduras, and Belize entered into the North American Alliance, where each country kept its own government, but created a council above them made up of the presidents and prime minister and two other officials that actually made most of the major decisions. It was more of a confederation than them merging into a single nation, but for all intents and purposes, they were a single entity.

Ahh, now that makes sense.

You see most of my family has been members of the Conservative Party of Canada for 90 odd years, but according to some of our American cousins, all of the Canadian family members are raving f'n Liberal fanatics.
(Those cousins are the ones didn't have the sense to come to Canada when the rest of my family baled out. )

But in all honesty I simply cannot see our political ideologies blending in with each other in the near future, except as a 'temporary' expedient.

[expedient]

Kyven has has an affect on a number of animals/monsters now; feral arcans, the horse Spirit and these Lupans. It may be nothing, or perhaps a clue to something more significant. All of them have a connection to mana energy through being magically altered/created or in his horse’s case crystals in his hooves. Of course the Lupans may have a patron spirit as with the shadow foxes influencing them. We’ll see how he gets along with Strider.

[SYED]

So the plan is to take and strip cheston, then siege the loreguard forces in the vaLLey so that they would help dana army. also freeing arcans on the way. This will allow flaur to attack, and geovan to seize cheston afterwards. So potential aliies in flaur ans geovan. While fewer arcans let the crystals last longer, the loreguard will still seize the mines, ensuring they get the crystals to fight, which they will need more of due to war so the crystal will go quicker. Also if they control the source of crystal they can force other to fight for them. They need to activly supply crystals to ensure demand. The thing is they have to increase their appearence if the loreguard wish for control. So they will have to send reinforcements to deal with flaur and the arcans. This would not be an issue but when kyven returns to the city they will be introuble. It was only to to having such a vast guard were they able to catch him, to effective catch him again with limited resources they would have to seed to him anywhere which is not a priority, clustering on the island. What would happen if he destroyed the bridge. he would cripple they abilty to move in the city quickly, forcing them to station men off the island.

[furry_wolf2001b]

Kyven is a monster arcan.
Not a fox not a wolf, but a "monster" arcan, so naturally the relation factors in.

[ANTIcarrot]

Kyven has has an affect on a number of animals/monsters now

A rose by any other name... etc etc. All the non spirit critters he's met up until now (monsters, arcans and humans included) are all animals, whatever the english language calls them. No behavior we've seen up until now is unprecedented in the animal kingdom. Remember as well that Kyven couldn't have enjoyed the success he did with the two wild arcans without Clover's guidance.

[Mad Monk]

Kyven has has an affect on a number of animals/monsters now

A rose by any other name... etc etc. All the non spirit critters he's met up until now (monsters, arcans and humans included) are all animals, whatever the english language calls them. No behavior we've seen up until now is unprecedented in the animal kingdom. Remember as well that Kyven couldn't have enjoyed the success he did with the two wild arcans without Clover's guidance.

It is an interesting study of nature / nurture.

I sometimes wonder if the difference between feral arcans and normal ones is that they do not have human intelligence, or if it is just that they are dominated by their instincts. Certainly the ones which Kyven helped seemed to have some intelligence.

Its just like the old joke:

A motorist had a flat tire in front of an insane asylum. He took the wheel off, but when he stood up he tipped over the hubcap containing the nuts, spilling them all down a sewer drain.

A patient, looking through the fence, suggested that the man take one bolt from
the remaining three wheels to hold the fourth wheel in place until he could get to a service station.

The motorist thanked him profusely and said, "I don't know why you are in that place."

The patient said, "I'm in here for being crazy, not for being stupid."

[D.F. Thompson]

Ok we know the Shadow Fox spirit can transport other people with her using the shadow jump(for lack of a better name.) And assuming that Keyvn can do the same. That would be a handy way to eliminate the lore guard leaders. Catch one of them alone jump in grab him/her jump back out, only leave them in the shadow realm for the shadows to take care of.