Shadow Walker 22 Thoughts and Spoilers

[Weresmilodon]

Now the discussion it taking an interesting turn.

Just how much of the Ancient Civilization's scientific observations were real world effects and how much was just belief-reinforced theory on how the world works?

Name three discoveries that were accepted right away without someone having to convince others to believe in it first.

Actually, can anyone name just one?

[afrigeek]

This is similar to the theory of how younger gods came to be in the sennadar universe. The power of belief.

[expedient]

Here's something else to think about: just what are the spirits? Are they real or the imaginings and rationalizations of the Arcans for what they've observed in the world? Could the Shadow Fox Spirit be as deceptive and manipulative as she is because Kyven never trusted the idea of benevolent spirits? Is the spirit world a reflection of the psyche of those sensitive to the spirit world i.e. shaman and their precursors?

[Zor]

Now the discussion it taking an interesting turn.

Just how much of the Ancient Civilization's scientific observations were real world effects and how much was just belief-reinforced theory on how the world works?

Name three discoveries that were accepted right away without someone having to convince others to believe in it first.

Actually, can anyone name just one?

Today's Discoveries? No.
But if you look at personal discoveries a little kid makes while growing - yes.
They discover that the sky is blue.
That gravity pulls things to the ground.
The sun rises in one location and sets in another.


As for the Ancient Civilization - a good number of the discoveries could of been belief reinforced. An example today in are world would be the higgins? particle. Math says it should exist, so people believe that is there. Math tends to be a really flexible and often hard to prove wrong really in that area.

[GBLW]

As for the Ancient Civilization - a good number of the discoveries could of been belief reinforced. An example today in are world would be the higgins? particle. Math says it should exist, so people believe that is there. Math tends to be a really flexible and often hard to prove wrong really in that area.

Ahh, I think you mean the Higgs bosun? Which may have just been proven to exist?
At least they observed something, but they can't be certain yet if it's the Higgs bosun, or some other similar effect/oddity(?) that appears to act and react in the same manner as that theoretical item.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-16222710

KP

[GBLW]

Of course if you really want to talk about an 'ancient' who advanced the 'belief in impossibilities' you could check out the theories of Leonardo da Vinci.
http://inventors.about.com/od/dstartinv ... o-DaVinci/

kp

[SYED]

Are the bestial arcans due to human belief that they are nothing more than animals? They were made by alchemy so could be affected by it.

Will spirits now they have seen kyvern, start making not only their own totem shamen or totem monsters, but their own totem arcan breed? They have seen how epic a creation he is so attemp to recreate the shadow fox success.

SO the ancients were Proto Alchists, they made a device that sublty draws energy, no risk to the world, by hand. SO I wonder if modern alchemist can encorparate this feature into moden day devices, possibly even providing power remptly with in certain ranges. SAy a city has a big version of the power drawer, it can power a bunch of little devices within its limits, so items wont be reliant on crystals as much. THe ability to create such deices would be increadibly valuable.

[Danl]

Few years ago some Utah university researchers claimed to have a working Cold Fusion device. No one else could get it to work. Everyone says it is a hoax. Maybe they were alchemists

[Spec8472]

Few years ago some Utah university researchers claimed to have a working Cold Fusion device. No one else could get it to work. Everyone says it is a hoax. Maybe they were alchemists

There's been countless people claiming to have created "cold fusion" devices... and whilst they may have achieved low temperature fusion, they've never been able to demonstrate that it can generate more energy than has gone into running it.

Same with folks who claim to have invented perpetual motion machines.

[dawich]

Few years ago some Utah university researchers claimed to have a working Cold Fusion device. No one else could get it to work. Everyone says it is a hoax. Maybe they were alchemists

Lot more than a few years ago - I was in college at the time, in Electrical Engineering, and we heard about it in class, so spent the rest of that class and my design lab discussing what it would mean for the field.

They might have been ok if they'd not announced it at a big press conference:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_fusio ... experiment

[tereszcz]

[quote="Spec8472"
There's been countless people claiming to have created "cold fusion" devices... and whilst they may have achieved low temperature fusion, they've never been able to demonstrate that it can generate more energy than has gone into running it.

Same with folks who claim to have invented perpetual motion machines.[/quote]

I just don't see how people can ignore the laws of thermodynamics. What I find strange is that some of these people have phd's in physics. I do wonder about their delusional abilities. I can't see how few watts could overcome the strong nuclear forces in the nucleus. It just does not compute. Cold fusion without some kind of catalyst is not going to happen, and the catalyst is not going to be a chemical. It needs to be a nuclear process.

[SYED]

WHat with Earth BOnd finishing soon, then we will have the last chapter of shadow walker sooner or later.

Kyvern wants his alchemist friend to build a device that the loremasters would never allow to exist. It cant be a simple weapon, it has to be something that threatens their base of power.
My belief is that it has something to do with Arcans:
a device to destroy or free all colors on Arcans,
or a device to turn the animalistic arcans into fully sentient arcans.

THese two devices would be something they hope are never created. THe loremasters need arcans enslaved and seen as beasts. As the shaman already have a spell to deactivate collars, a device to heal them would be great. It would greatly increase arcan numbers, as they would be able to communicate better with the bestial arcan.

If shamans can do any thing alchemist can do, can alchemists create devices to mimic arcan spells. Imagine a harness that allows spider walking. A weapon that mimics vampire draining skill.

[hoppy]

WHat with Earth BOnd finishing soon, then we will have the last chapter of shadow walker sooner or later.

Kyvern wants his alchemist friend to build a device that the loremasters would never allow to exist. It cant be a simple weapon, it has to be something that threatens their base of power.
My belief is that it has something to do with Arcans:
a device to destroy or free all colors on Arcans,
or a device to turn the animalistic arcans into fully sentient arcans.

THese two devices would be something they hope are never created. THe loremasters need arcans enslaved and seen as beasts. As the shaman already have a spell to deactivate collars, a device to heal them would be great. It would greatly increase arcan numbers, as they would be able to communicate better with the bestial arcan.

If shamans can do any thing alchemist can do, can alchemists create devices to mimic arcan spells. Imagine a harness that allows spider walking. A weapon that mimics vampire draining skill.

I don't think it is either of your ideas.
To work better than a grounder for freeing arcans a device would have to be area affect I don't remember any devices working that way.
Since no one is sure why animalistic arcans are not fully sentient that is a shot in the dark and too long term to justify starting now.
Neither is unpredictable or nasty enough from The Loremasters POV.

[SYED]

WHen they were holding that fortress in that slave city, the loreguard ordered the arcans in collars to attack the walls. THe shaman when the arcans got in range, cast a spell that unlocked and deactivated the collars. When the arcans got into the fort safely, the lore guard commander tried to kill them all, but he could not kill them through the collar commands any longer. So shaman dont need a device to unlock collars.
I wonder if part of the reason why there are bestial arcans, is because people believe they are animals, and as they are creations of alchemy, it causes some to be beastly.
Kyvern claims that the loreguard was so afraid of the device that they killed the creator, there are plenty of dangerous and deadly devices around, but would they really have hidden it away. THe loremasters would simply produce the weapons for themselves, so it had to be something not even they themselves could have.

I wonder if Kyvern will clear out the loremaster library of alchemical designs and knowledge. That way he can produce other devices those naughty loremasters hid over the years.

Another option would be a device that shatters crystals in a range. Their whole economy and way of life is dependent on crystal, so the loremasters could not have such a device existing. SAy Kyvern shadow walked this device into the centre of the loremaster island, then most of the crystal supplies and devices would be destroyed, leaving it to be freely pillaged. If the human armies lost their crystal, then much weaponry of the war would be dealt with, forcing them to depend on the non crystal weaponry, and their greatly reduced logistical ability. SInce crystals can be harmed by sound, make it a sonic weapon aimed at crystals.