Some Inconsistances in Subjugation?

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Hearly
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Some Inconsistances in Subjugation?

Post by Hearly » Thu Feb 01, 2007 3:09 am

Ok, Now I was thinking/looking over some things, and I guess most of them are from the fact that you started Sub. as a Diversion and never got serious with it until 10.

1st, The Mindbenders taking the humans to be "reprogrammed" to be good little Imperium citizens, now at least the way it was worded, It seemed it was the Imperuim doing it and not Trilliane, I can see that once Jason blew the whistle, at that point it was worthless to take them..

2nd, Slavery, why was the Empress so upset about Trilliane Selling Humans into slavery when for the most part they put the Entire planet into Slavery, Putting people on Farms that were set up as Prisons, and not paying them, that sounds like Slavery to me..

3rd, Trilliane didn't own Earth, it was owned by the Imperuim so why could the Trillianes come in and disband all governments and totally change around the planet, there are other Races in the Imperium were they treated the same way at the start, and over time they became "real" citizens?

heh yes I know I'm Nitpicking but was wondering about a few of these..

:shock:

Edit:

Anyone else notice anything?

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Re: Some Inconsistances in Subjugation?

Post by Quindo Ma » Thu Feb 01, 2007 8:16 am

Hearly wrote:1st, The Mindbenders taking the humans to be "reprogrammed" to be good little Imperium citizens, now at least the way it was worded, It seemed it was the Imperuim doing it and not Trilliane, I can see that once Jason blew the whistle, at that point it was worthless to take them..
That is a plot point that Fel deliberately left open. As far as we know, there was only ever one human telepath taken for sure, the girl in Jason's school (though more were implied). And we can assume that no more were taken after Jason's interview because of what was said.
Hearly wrote:2nd, Slavery, why was the Empress so upset about Trilliane Selling Humans into slavery when for the most part they put the Entire planet into Slavery, Putting people on Farms that were set up as Prisons, and not paying them, that sounds like Slavery to me..
Trillane was given Earth to produce food, and the empress didn't truly have the abilities to do anything openhanded without tipping off Trillane that she knew exactly what was going on. Plus, Trillane was stepping over most imperial laws on their whim, Humans should have been treated completely differently from the start. But as long as the food quotas were kept up, there was little that could be done with the way everything was hushed up.
Hearly wrote:3rd, Trilliane didn't own Earth, it was owned by the Imperuim so why could the Trillianes come in and disband all governments and totally change around the planet, there are other Races in the Imperium were they treated the same way at the start, and over time they became "real" citizens?
It wasn't the Trillanes that disbanded the governments, it was the Imperium, from what the storyline indicates (first chapter). Once that was done, and Trillane took over, they just rampaged through the whole population as they wanted. They made sure food was going out, and everything else that was done was hidden from the empire. Dahnai couldn't find out anything without Kimdori help, it was that bad.

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Re: Some Inconsistances in Subjugation?

Post by ANTIcarrot » Thu Feb 01, 2007 5:14 pm

Careful. Questioning the Way of Fel can get you burned as a hieratic round here. That said...
Hearly wrote:1st, The Mindbenders [...] It seemed it was the Imperuim doing it and not Trilliane,
Remember that (despite what some round here with to believe) Jason and Jyslin are not oracles, especially at the start of the story, and are proven wrong about many things as the plot progresses. At this point it is said they *believe* it's the imperium. But Fel never actually says it was. The Trillane could done all sorts of things to obscure what they were doing. Or it could just be a revision error Fel never got around to fixing.
2nd, Slavery, why was the Empress so upset about Trilliane Selling Humans into slavery
She probably sees Farm Work as a form of 'conscription' and 'necessary policing policy'. Like prisoners in the US get paid a dollar an hour for making License plates. And...
3rd, Trilliane didn't own Earth, it was owned by the Imperuim so why could the Trillianes...
The Empress knows the Trillane are planning war. She also knows they will break Impreial law right left and center if they think they can get away with it. She was probably giving them all the rope they wanted in the hopes they hung themselves, as they ended up doing.

The Empress is also not Rainbow Bright. Unlike sennadar's magic goddess there are real and fundamental limitations to her power. She HAD to give earth to the Trillanes, remember? Not being able to tell them exactly how to behave on Earth is probably one of those limits, in part because doing otherwise woudl expose the bluff that 'my house is bigger than yours' that she's been running, and probably non-interference rules in the house charter.
Anyone else notice anything?
Fel has stated that the Faey are humans who were transplanted on Draconis and developed telepathy there. That being the case, and ignoring skin colour as irrelevant, you have two races here, Telepaths and Non Telepaths. The story focuses exclusively on Telepaths, and leaves the NTs as mere spear-carrying non-entities without the brains to have an opinion of their own. Compare and contrast with Apatite TV; or the works of Anne McCaffery. Though likely no deliberate it is rather silly.

See also the last post in Fun with Faey Tech. Human corporations have no way to keep their secrets secret. Without that they can only compete in areas the Faey don't wish to dirty their hands with. Like farming and other forms of manual labor. It is questionable whether humanity would be allowed to deploy the same kind of security measures as the Moridons have on their banking planet.

I still find the universal surrender unbelievable, unless the world leaders were being telepathically prodded. Logically if the Faey want the planet there is a limit to how much damage they can do, and in a conventional war the Humanity might stand a chance against an enemy at the end of a long supply chain. There's more to it of course (telepathy etc) but the world leaders should have acted based upon what they knew at the time, not what Jason knew two years later.

Soma crop dusting & economics. What happened to the world economy is never explained. If Trillaine smashed it to pieces and shut down every company that took their fancy (like Boeing, Microsoft, AMD) that would do much more damage than a mere 3 million kidnapped humans. (Not to be too callous, but about that many die of old age on earth each day.) If they did behave like Nazis and commit acts of 'economic cleansing', why don't people hate them like the Nazis? If they didn't, why weren't more powerful humans capable of carrying on as business as usual? A lot of what Fel tells us is contradictory. A more cohesive view of the situation on Earth would have been nice.

And naughty Fel. You did a lot of telling in this story, and not nearly as much showing as you should. :)
Last edited by ANTIcarrot on Thu Feb 01, 2007 6:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Some Inconsistances in Subjugation?

Post by mbeau » Thu Feb 01, 2007 5:43 pm

ANTIcarrot wrote:Careful. Questioning the Way of Fel can get you burned as a hieratic round here. That said...
Harassing Fel for more chapters gets you burned, not asking questions about why things are the way they are in his stories.
Hearly wrote:1st, The Mindbenders [...] It seemed it was the Imperuim doing it and not Trilliane,
Remember that (despite what some round here with to believe) Jason and Jyslin are not oracles, especially at the start of the story, and are proven wrong about many things as the plot progresses. At this point it is said they *believe* it's the imperium. But Fel never actually says it was. The Trillane could done all sorts of things to obscure what they were doing. Or it coudl just be a revision error Fel never got around to fixing.
It doesn't have anything to do with Jyslin. At the beginning, for Jason, the Imperium and the Trillane are the same thing. There is no difference to him. It is only about halfway through when he starts attacking the Trillanes that he realizes that it is the Trillanes that are at fault, not the entire Imperium. That is why he is very careful to point that out in his statement and in his attacks.
2nd, Slavery, why was the Empress so upset about Trilliane Selling Humans into slavery
She probably sees Farm Work as a form of 'conscription' and 'necessary policing policy'. Like prisoners in the US get paid a dollar an hour for making License plates. And...
Ummm, no. When the Imperium subjugated Earth, they became Imperial citizens with the same rights as the Faey. That is the first reason. The second is that the Trillane were not just selling them into slavery, they were enslaving them so that the enslaved humans would be the cannon fodder for a Trillane army set on overthrowing the Merranes(??) as the Imperial House.
3rd, Trilliane didn't own Earth, it was owned by the Imperuim so why could the Trillianes come in and disband all governments and totally change around the planet, there are other Races in the Imperium were they treated the same way at the start, and over time they became "real" citizens?
Earth was owned by the Imperium, but it was "rented/leased" by the Trillane to produce food for the Imperium. As long as the Trillane didn't get caught doing anything against the Imperial laws, there is probably little the Imperium could do. I don't think that Fel has revealed a lot to us about what exactly are the rules/laws that are put in place when a species is subjugated by the Faey, or on the house that takes a contract like the Trillanes.
The Empress knows the Trillane's are planning war. She also knows they will break Impreial law right left and center if they think they can get away with it. She was probably giving them all the rope they wanted in the hopes they hung themselves, as they ended up doing.

The Empress is also not Rainbow Bright. Unlike sennadar's magic goddess there are real and fundamental limitations to her power. She HAD to give earth to the Trillanes, remember? Not being able to tell them exactly how to behave on Earth is probably one of those limits, in part because doing otherwise woudl expose the bluff that 'my house is bigger than yours' that she's been running, and probably non-interference rules in the house charter.
She didn't have to give Earth to the Trillanes, but they were the ones who probably put in the most attractive bid for the contract. As for not being able to tell them how to behave, Trillane had to treat the citizens of Earth as Imperial citizens. They had the same rights as the Faey. However, the Empress only gets status reports from Earth as provided by the Trillane. If they falsify the data good enough so that it can't be detected, there is little she can do.
Fel has stated that the Faey are humans who were transplanted on Draconis and developed telepathy there.
Cite please??

Wasn't it Songa who said that because Earth and Draconis were almost exactly the same, it (was) highly probably that the development of the major species would follow similar evolutionary pathways.

<snip>
I still find the universal surrender unbelievable, unless the world leaders were being telepathically prodded. Logically if the Faey want the planet there is a limit to how much damage they can do, and in a conventional car the Humanity might stand a chance against an enemy at the end of a long supply chain.
Only up to a point. The fact is that when the Faey invaded and conquered Earth, their technological superiority was so high that humans simply couldn't match it. They controlled space, so they could send down kinetic bombardment weapons at wiiol. There is nothing earth could have done to prevent the Faey from doimg what they want. When you combine that very large stick with the carrot of advanced technology and medical advances, it doesn't take much to see how it was inevitable.
There's more to it of course (telepathy etc) but the world leaders should have acted based upon what they knew at the time, not what Jason knew two years later.
That only works if the technological levels are close. When they are as far apart as they were, it's not surprising. Also, Jason had access to Faey technology. He trained on it and could purchase Faey parts over Civnet (or through Kumi). WHen Earth was being invaded, do you think that was possible?? Not at all.
Some crop dusting & economics. What happened to the world economy is never explained. If Trillaine smashed it to pieces and shut down every company that took their fancy (like Boeing, Microsoft, AMD) that would do much more damage than a mere 3 million kidnapped humans. (Not to be too callous, but about that many die of old age on earth each day.) If they did behave like Nazis and commit acts of 'economic cleansing', why don't peopel hate them like the Nazis? If they didn't, why weren't more powerful humans capable of carrying on as business as usual? A lot of what Fel tells us is contradictory. A more cohesive view of the situation on Earth would have been nice.
There is a lot of stretching in this last paragraph that really has no basis in the parts of what Fel has provided.
Last edited by mbeau on Thu Feb 01, 2007 5:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Some Inconsistances in Subjugation?

Post by ANTIcarrot » Thu Feb 01, 2007 5:54 pm

It doesn't have anything to do with Jyslin.
Try reading the story again. It was JYSLIN who explained to Jason what was going on when the campus went into lock down. SHE was the one who implied the Imperium was the one kidnapping the human telepaths. So yes, it does have something to do with her.

Before being a fanatic, try being a little more expert in your chosen subject. Also learn to check that 'what you think is being said' is actually the same as 'what it really being said'.

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Re: Some Inconsistances in Subjugation?

Post by mbeau » Thu Feb 01, 2007 6:09 pm

ANTIcarrot wrote:
It doesn't have anything to do with Jyslin.
Try reading the story again. It was JYSLIN who explained to Jason what was going on when the campus went into lock down. SHE was the one who implied the Imperium was the one kidnapping the human telepaths. So yes, it does have something to do with her.
We are talking about two different things here. My comment was on the general problems that Jason had with the Faey who had invaded Earth. You are talking about the specific situation when the first human (besides Tim) expresses Telepathic ability.

Also

From Chpater 5, about 3/4 of the way through (based on on-line reading)
Spoiler: show
Jyslin: “Well, they took that girl to Houston, and from what I’ve heard, they’ve started examining her. There was a detachment of mindbenders there waiting for her,” she said with a shudder. “The Baron walked around and looked at things, then he left. Odds are, he went to Houston too, then he’ll probably go up to the orbital station to meet with the Duchess. She came in on a transport about two hours ago.”

My comment - The Baron and Duchess they are talking about here are from House Trillane

...

(from Jyslin again) Not much, really, she answered, looking sideways at him as he did her. So far there’s been absolutely no word about how the Trillanes are going to respond to this. But it goes further up than them, really. Some of the decisions that come down may be Imperial. If the Empress doesn’t like how the Trillanes respond, some orders may come down from Royal Command, and that’s nothing but the Empress’ commands. The Trillanes might have to take orders from Empress Dahnai if they don’t handle it in a way she approves.

My comment - Here is proof that for the time being, the decisions that are being made are being made by House Trillane. The Imperium is watching their decisions and what they do, but hasn't stepped in yet.
Before being a fanatic, try being a little more expert in your chosen subject. Also learn to check that 'what you think is being said' is actually the same as 'what it really being said'.
Where the fuck did this comment come from??

edit to add

This is a discussion forum. We post ideas and other people comment on them. I am not sure how me commenting on your ideas and thinking that some of them are wrong turned me into a fanatic, or an "expert in my chosen subject".

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Re: Some Inconsistances in Subjugation?

Post by Hearly » Thu Feb 01, 2007 6:36 pm

mbeau wrote: Ummm, no. When the Imperium subjugated Earth, they became Imperial citizens with the same rights as the Faey. That is the first reason. The second is that the Trillane were not just selling them into slavery, they were enslaving them so that the enslaved humans would be the cannon fodder for a Trillane army set on overthrowing the Merranes(??) as the Imperial House.
Yes, but what I'm saying here, is there were Imperial Marines on Earth, there had to be other Oversight people on Earth, Taking one look at the farms and seeing how Imperial citizens were being treated, seeing them never having a Credit deposited into any of there accounts, etc Should be a flag that something is going on that should not be, you do not need spies to see that..

Now maybe she wanted to let them hang themselves by letting them seem to get away with it, but to me right there would have been enough to take earth away from the Trililanes

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Re: Some Inconsistances in Subjugation?

Post by ANTIcarrot » Thu Feb 01, 2007 6:47 pm

"Well, they took that girl to Houston, and from what I’ve heard, they’ve started examining her. There was a detachment of mindbenders there waiting for her,” she said with a shudder. [...] "Well, if she survives that, they’ll probably take her to Draconis, fix her, train her, then use her as an agent for the mindbenders,” Jyslin said with a dark look. “A human telepath could go many places in the galaxy that other races would never allow one of us, because they know we’re telepathic, where they know from our own records that humans aren’t. She’ll end up being one hell of a spy."
Why would house Trillane take someone so useful to the heart of Imperial space, rather than one of their own planets, where they would have far more control? Several marines in her squad have the power and capacity to be mind benders, but are not referred to as such.

My understanding is that 'mindbender' is like 'spook' or 'company man' and refers to a specific agency of the Imperial government. The threat to the Duchess I believe is being discussed as a separate implication of the same subject.
My comment - Here is proof that for the time being, the decisions that are being made are being made by House Trillane. The Imperium is watching their decisions and what they do, but hasn't stepped in yet.
Maybe not. 'Respond to this' could be the girl OR the possibility of more human telepaths. Given the context I favor that the latter possibility. The girl is dealt with after all, there is no need to react further to the former.

Edited in the interests of forum harmony.
Last edited by ANTIcarrot on Thu Feb 01, 2007 6:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Some Inconsistances in Subjugation?

Post by mbeau » Thu Feb 01, 2007 6:48 pm

Hearly wrote:
mbeau wrote: Ummm, no. When the Imperium subjugated Earth, they became Imperial citizens with the same rights as the Faey. That is the first reason. The second is that the Trillane were not just selling them into slavery, they were enslaving them so that the enslaved humans would be the cannon fodder for a Trillane army set on overthrowing the Merranes(??) as the Imperial House.
Yes, but what I'm saying here, is there were Imperial Marines on Earth, there had to be other Oversight people on Earth, Taking one look at the farms and seeing how Imperial citizens were being treated, seeing them never having a Credit deposited into any of there accounts, etc Should be a flag that something is going on that should not be, you do not need spies to see that..

Now maybe she wanted to let them hang themselves by letting them seem to get away with it, but to me right there would have been enough to take earth away from the Trililanes
The Empress was gathering information on them, but it was all circumstantial.

From Chapter 19, just after Jason belts the matriarch of Trillane:
Spoiler: show
“I’m a little confused, your Majesty,” he said honestly. “You knew all along?”

“Of course I did, but there wasn’t much I could do about it,” she told him.

...

“Bullshit I saved them,” she said with a sigh. “I shoulda stepped on Maeri before we even knew Terra was there, but she’s a damned crafty old bitch. She’s always been just out of my reach, keeping out of my hands by hiding behind the robes of the other members of the Highborn Council. She always had just enough support to slip out of any punishment. Until today, that is.”

“May I ask a question, your Majesty?”

“Sure, go ahead.”

“You knew about all of this, didn’t you? All of what Trillane did, and you knew I was coming here, didn’t you?”

“Sure did,” she said with a nod. “The Kimdori have been keeping me up to speed. They brought most of the information I’m using to blackmail Maeri to me. I’m not sure why, though, it’s not like them to get involved in the affairs of others without being paid. I’ll have to look into that, I suppose,” she said, tousling her bronze hair absently.

“What did you have on them?”

“Theft, and a hell of a lot of it. They were stealing Terra blind. They were also setting up, using Terra as an out-of-sight staging ground to build up their military and get it ready. Mainly, they were channeling weapons and military hardware through Terra, taking delivery and then shipping it elsewhere, but the main thing I have them on is stealing.”

“Stealing? Didn’t they have ownership?”

“They had a contract,” she said distinctly. “The planet belongs to the Imperium, Jason, not Trillane. What they were doing was basicly stripping the planet of anything valuable they thought they could get away with stealing. I was keeping track of everything they took and I was gonna nail them with a fine at the end of the fiscal cycle, but when they started slaving and kidnapping Terrans, that was it. That was when I sent in the Kimdori, to find out what the hell was going on over there, find out everything in the way only a Kimdori can. What they dug up for me almost made me throw up. I had to get rid of them, but it’s not easy to get rid of Maeri Trillane.”

...

“Yeah. It was serious. But Maeri was very careful, and she did very well to fix it so I don’t have any real evidence to present to the Highborns, just intel gathered by the Kimdori, which isn’t the kind of evidence I can use in an official matter. So, I had to get her through the back door.”
Also, I apologize, Healy, for the tone I took with ANTICarrot in my post above. Hope it doesn't ruin your thread too much or get it spanked by Spec.

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Re: Some Inconsistances in Subjugation?

Post by ANTIcarrot » Thu Feb 01, 2007 6:57 pm

Hearly wrote:Now maybe she wanted to let them hang themselves by letting them seem to get away with it, but to me right there would have been enough to take earth away from the Trililanes
There is a lot of corruption in the Imperium. If other houses were running 'sweat shop' style enterprises, they would band behind Trillane out of enlightened self interest. I can see ideas like 'Debters prisons' being very popular with some houses, and that's slavery in all but name.

Several years ago there was a story about world cup footballs being made by children in china. It only got so far as the football makers weren't the only ones doing, and the other companies brought political pressure to ensure the government didn't do anything about it.

And think how the houses would see it. Would does the Dehnai need an excuse to come down hard on Trillane? Surely the Empress can do so on a whim! Or maybe she's not all actually as powerful as she likes to imply. Maybe she's actually rather week, and we should get on Trillane's side... Politics can be horribly convoluted. But something like that might be going on.

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Re: Some Inconsistances in Subjugation?

Post by mbeau » Thu Feb 01, 2007 6:59 pm

ANTIcarrot wrote:
"Well, they took that girl to Houston, and from what I’ve heard, they’ve started examining her. There was a detachment of mindbenders there waiting for her,” she said with a shudder. [...] "Well, if she survives that, they’ll probably take her to Draconis, fix her, train her, then use her as an agent for the mindbenders,” Jyslin said with a dark look. “A human telepath could go many places in the galaxy that other races would never allow one of us, because they know we’re telepathic, where they know from our own records that humans aren’t. She’ll end up being one hell of a spy."
Why would house Trillane take someone so useful to the heart of Imperial space, rather than one of their own planets, where they would have far more control? Several marines in her squad have the power and capacity to be mind benders, but are not referred to as such.
House Trillane would be taking them to the heart of Imperial Space because they know that if they try to make her disappear, the Imperium will strip the house to the bedrock to find her again. This is a find that is *very* important to the Faey. As long as Trillane is going in the same direction as the Imperium, the Imperium is probably content to allow Trillane run things. As soon as they start diverging, the Imperium will take over.

As for those in Jyslin's squad who have the power to be mindbenders, they also needed to have the proper psychological profile to become a mindbender.
My understanding is that 'mindbender' is like 'spook' or 'company man' and refers to a specific agency of the Imperial government. The threat to the Duchess I believe is being discussed as a separate implication of the same subject.
I don't think so. I think mindbender is a generic term for anybody trained in that particular skillset.
My comment - Here is proof that for the time being, the decisions that are being made are being made by House Trillane. The Imperium is watching their decisions and what they do, but hasn't stepped in yet.
Maybe not. 'Respond to this' could be the girl OR the possibility of more human telepaths. Given the context I favor that the latter possibility. The girl is dealt with after all, there is no need to react further to the former.
I think that it covers both how they handle the girl, as well as the possibility that there may be other human telepaths.

Where the fuck did this comment come from??
From your habit of misreading something I write and then post completely spurious evidence that something I didn't say is actually wrong. And for stating several things about the story which are not correct. Such as saying 'Jyslin had nothing to do with it'.
Whah?? This is the first time that I have replied to anything that you have posted. As for Spurious?? I am posting my opinion on the reasons behind. You are doing the same. Why are mine spurious, but yours the truth?? Until Fel comes down as says something, neither of us is right. We are both just stating possibilities.

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Re: Some Inconsistances in Subjugation?

Post by mbeau » Thu Feb 01, 2007 7:04 pm

ANTIcarrot wrote:
Hearly wrote:Now maybe she wanted to let them hang themselves by letting them seem to get away with it, but to me right there would have been enough to take earth away from the Trililanes
There is a lot of corruption in the Imperium. If other houses were running 'sweat shop' style enterprises, they would band behind Trillane out of enlightened self interest. I can see ideas like 'Debters prisons' being very popular with some houses, and that's slavery in all but name.
I am not sure about the corruption (would be difficult with telepaths), but Fel does reveal in the conversation between Jason and the Empress that there are a number of houses that are trying to take the Throne away from the Merrane. Trillane just had the inside track because of the fact that humans could be reprogrammed into soldiers.
Spoiler: show
“To try to take my throne, that’s why,” she said bluntly. “Right now, babes, the four biggest Highborn houses all have plots underway to hamstring the other three houses and take the throne from Merrane. They were in the first stages of executing that plan. The others talk about it, plan for it, but Trillane was about to do it. They were raping Terra to raise the cash they needed to arm without it appearing on the books anywhere, doing it under the table. But the biggest issue, babes, was that they were kidnapping Terrans of suitable age and conscripting them. That’s where a hell of a lot of your people went, babes. Millions of them. They’re on Uruma, now loyal little lapdogs to Trillane and ready to fight for the house. The Urumi have the slimy hands in this too, they’re still pissed off over what happened in the Third Civil War. Trillane’s been kidnapping fit Terrans and shipping them to Uruma, where they’ve been training them to be soldiers after using talent to make them more, tractable. Humans are vulnerable to talent, hon, and the Trillanes were using that for everything it was worth, by reprogramming your people to turn them into soldiers for their house.

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Re: Some Inconsistances in Subjugation?

Post by ANTIcarrot » Thu Feb 01, 2007 9:52 pm

mbeau wrote:I am not sure about the corruption (would be difficult with telepaths),
Selection for officer core naval training does seem more dependent on who you know, rather than what. Like the British Navy before Nelson. I believe Jyslin (or one of the other characters) wanted to be an engineer, but couldn't actually get an engineering post in the faey navy because some daft rich brat took her post.

If they're willing to allow (or can't prevent, or desire) corruption in their navy (upon which they depend for defense) why not elsewhere as well?

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Re: Some Inconsistances in Subjugation?

Post by mbeau » Fri Feb 02, 2007 1:44 pm

ANTIcarrot wrote:
mbeau wrote:I am not sure about the corruption (would be difficult with telepaths),
Selection for officer core naval training does seem more dependent on who you know, rather than what. Like the British Navy before Nelson. I believe Jyslin (or one of the other characters) wanted to be an engineer, but couldn't actually get an engineering post in the faey navy because some daft rich brat took her post.

If they're willing to allow (or can't prevent, or desire) corruption in their navy (upon which they depend for defense) why not elsewhere as well?
That's not really corruption. Pretty close, but not really. It is the same thing as someone who owns a business deciding who they want to go where. Given a choice between two people who are equally qualified, chances are he will pick the child of a friend rather than that of a stranger.

Spec8472
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Re: Some Inconsistances in Subjugation?

Post by Spec8472 » Fri Feb 02, 2007 1:54 pm

mbeau wrote:That's not really corruption. Pretty close, but not really. It is the same thing as someone who owns a business deciding who they want to go where. Given a choice between two people who are equally qualified, chances are he will pick the child of a friend rather than that of a stranger.
Yeah, it is actually corruption -- tis called <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nepotism">nepotism</a>.

Here in Australia (Well, the State of New South Wales, anyway)- it'll get you referred to the <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independen ... ndependent Commission Against Corruption</a> (ICAC). "Where the ICAC rules that an official has acted corruptly, the charges are referred to the criminal justice system for trial."

I'm sure there's other equivalents in other Australian states, and probably a federal level equivalent too.

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