Conviction Chapter 10 {Spoilers}

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Hello World
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Conviction Chapter 10 {Spoilers}

Post by Hello World »

Well, the fecal matter has certainly hit the rotary impeller this chapter. And here I was thinking things were going pretty well at the end of the last chapter. And then out of nowhere, a potential massive security breach as well as hints of a supervirus. What is everybody's thoughts on the bombshells that were dropped this chapter? The most interesting part I found was the ability to understand communion; it brings up many questions like: are they only limited to listening to communion, or can they commune themselves? Can they utilize biogenic systems? And so on.
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Re: Conviction Chapter 10 {Spoilers}

Post by kyli »

Gosh, i don't want to be in Jason's shoes right now. What an effing mess!!! I was cautiously optimistic about the Pai's ability to understand commune but the Imperial family turning into Generations is a nightmare. Added together, its a mess!!!! Mix in the war with the syndicate and its chaos incarnate!!!

On a side note, since Generations are telekinic, that means Sirri and all her children will also have that ability since it comes with being a Generation. If it becomes common knowledge that everyone in the family is telekinic, then someone might suspect that they are somehow Generations. But i get the feeling it might eventually become common knowledge anyway.

Jason noticed something was wrong with Shya. Just curious, but was it the ability to sense Generations/Kimdori or that made him feel the transition or was it just the way she physically looked? I suspect it is the former.

Another reaction i'll be really curious to hear about is Zaa's reaction, or the Kimdori reaction as a whole. The Kimdori relationship between them and the Karinnes is because of the Generations. Well it started as an alliance when the Kimdori were threatened by the Moridon virus and the Karinnes helped them but, with the Generation program, they became family. Now the Imperium Royal family might intrude themselves into the relationship.
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Re: Conviction Chapter 10 {Spoilers}

Post by Fel »

kyli wrote:Jason noticed something was wrong with Shya. Just curious, but was it the ability to sense Generations/Kimdori or that made him feel the transition or was it just the way she physically looked? I suspect it is the former.
You're right. Jason didn't realize it, but Shya was triggering his "Kimdori sense."
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Re: Conviction Chapter 10 {Spoilers}

Post by SoronelHaetir »

Hello World wrote:Well, the fecal matter has certainly hit the rotary impeller this chapter. And here I was thinking things were going pretty well at the end of the last chapter. And then out of nowhere, a potential massive security breach as well as hints of a supervirus. What is everybody's thoughts on the bombshells that were dropped this chapter? The most interesting part I found was the ability to understand communion; it brings up many questions like: are they only limited to listening to communion, or can they commune themselves? Can they utilize biogenic systems? And so on.
I'm pretty sure the Princess' response when Jason asked if she understood indicates that (just like Generations) once exposed to communion she was able to do it with nearly instinctive ease.
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Re: Conviction Chapter 10 {Spoilers}

Post by SoronelHaetir »

It occurs to me that Jason is going to have a difficult time explaining Dahnai's sudden disappearance. Especially given how she was the gavel holder prior to the virus.

I suppose the Faey near-reverence towards doctors will help some, but I expect the Siann to go nuts with her being completely out of contact on Karis.
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Re: Conviction Chapter 10 {Spoilers}

Post by Tuga555 »

Two things, well really three.
First although the Pei might "commune" they are not "cousins" so not really a Kimdori problem just a security one; and if they can commune but not gestalt with the crystals they can be used to "confuse/muddle" the issue "See its just like a jack, the generations and the Pei can do it without the jack. Its just a small hardware diference".
Second The Royal House of Merane being generations is fascinating with endless possibilities, the immediate one is a stronger telepathic telekinetic RH because its already in their genome, and a close connection with the Karines for security. Now the Kimdori reaction might be interesting, specialty IF my main suspects of bringing the Fey from Australia to Draconis are true, The Kimdori :)
Third,Fel is a mean, mean writer, because a in full chapter with a Kimdori debrief of Benga interrogations, and not ONE single mention of the Oracle.
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Re: Conviction Chapter 10 {Spoilers}

Post by kyli »

I wonder what percentage of the Pai population is telepathic? That wasnt asked in the chapter. It seems to me that the Pai's brain is a lot more advanced in evolution then any other known race except maybe the Generations. Commune is a more advanced form of telepathy with more "bandwidth" if i understand it correctly. It also makes a guy wonder what other psychic abilities the Pai have. They probably have a small number of telekinesis among them. And if it turns out that the Pai can boost their power with Biogenics, (which i kindof hope is the case, even with that problems that might bring with it,) then we might see there home world depopulated of telepaths as they all join the house of karinne. I'm hoping Jason succeeds in a very powerful alliance in any case.
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Re: Conviction Chapter 10 {Spoilers}

Post by Wolfee »

kyli wrote:I wonder what percentage of the Pai population is telepathic? That wasnt asked in the chapter. It seems to me that the Pai's brain is a lot more advanced in evolution then any other known race except maybe the Generations. Commune is a more advanced form of telepathy with more "bandwidth" if i understand it correctly. It also makes a guy wonder what other psychic abilities the Pai have. They probably have a small number of telekinesis among them. And if it turns out that the Pai can boost their power with Biogenics, (which i kindof hope is the case, even with that problems that might bring with it,) then we might see there home world depopulated of telepaths as they all join the house of karinne. I'm hoping Jason succeeds in a very powerful alliance in any case.
It would be funny if some ancient Karinne did something very naughty a thousand years and more ago and that Pai are basically a feline splinter of the house. I think that the Jason, the Denmother and the house as a whole just might blow a collective mental gasket. You know some Karinne had to be a little bit Dr EVIL Mad Scientist.... You know.... "lets see what happens if we do..."

I just don't know a race like the Pai or the Prakarikai simply have the brain size for the intelligence and abilities Fel wants them to have. Brains can only be so dense. Its like dolphins, dogs and cats on earth run into this issue. (Dolphins is probably a bad example as their brains are highly specialized to enable them to have sonar abilities and have the 2nd highest brain to body mass number on the planet, next to us.) They simply don't have the brain size for the job. While size isn't everything (thats not what she said) there is a certain body mass to brain mass that as far as we can tell thus far is required for sentient intelligence.
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Re: Conviction Chapter 10 {Spoilers}

Post by SYED »

That system has to be against the odds, it has not only three habitable planets, but two sentient races at near equivalent tech levels. Not only that but one of the races has the ability to perceive communion, one of the most valuable qualities in the galaxy. This system simply chosen at random. I have to ask if they asked the Oracle system to choose the co ordinates for the rally system.

I wonder if the Benga have advanced Quantum based technology, similar to how those other had greatly advanced their Ion based technology. It might allow the Karrines to seemingly devalue their biogenic systems. Similar, to how the jacks mimicked mind to machine control, the quantum entangled computers would allow them to have real time communications. The more they give a technological alternative to generations, the safer they will be from those after their gifts. Imagine this tech getting a karrine upgrade. Just because it is lower level tech does not mean it won't be valuable. Look at the translight engine, they encountered a more advanced form of it, that not only were they able to improve but make far more viable.

It might be that virus killing virus was somehow artificial. It would have been a great solution to that deadly virus it feeds upon. The kimdori are a living collection of viruses. So it stands to reason they have had to become experts on virology in all its forms. These details need t kept ultra secret, or there will be races experimenting with alsorts of virus techniques. The fact the generations are a tiny bit kimdori is kept a secret correct, so they have one advantage at least. But there might be those that suspect the kimdori are involved due to the kimdori close relations with the house.

I just can't believe a race narurally had communion level telepathy, either the kimdori/karrine got it from them, they were given it by a race involved in the project or another race attempted to bride the gap between telepaths and machines. It makes more sense for a at least one of that unique system races to have originated else where. They represent thousands of telepaths, possibly more. If they can have they abilities boosted, tha is a huge increase in capability for the military.

We guess they will want a close relationship with the new guys. I can see them renting transport and cargo ship for intrasystem shipping as well as the tech and equipment to extract materials from their gas local gas giant. Eventually it would allow them to financial independence.

I wonder if they could adapt this virus to enhance telepaths related to the generations, so keep it in house. Lots of families have children with different parents, some are generations while some are not. It would be a way to boost numbers.
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Re: Conviction Chapter 10 {Spoilers}

Post by Hugin »

What if this virus is the solution to safely convert fey to generations? What could happen if all fey and humans could become generations. What would a ship full generations do? Just thinking....
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Re: Conviction Chapter 10 {Spoilers}

Post by Hello World »

SYED wrote:That system has to be against the odds, it has not only three habitable planets, but two sentient races at near equivalent tech levels. Not only that but one of the races has the ability to perceive communion, one of the most valuable qualities in the galaxy. This system simply chosen at random. I have to ask if they asked the Oracle system to choose the co ordinates for the rally system.
Huh, good point. Although IIRC, it was stated in the intelligence report that it was chosen as random (I may be pulling this out of my ass here). Of course, the oracle system could have also included the instructions to broadcast that it was chosen at random as well, so who knows.
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Re: Conviction Chapter 10 {Spoilers}

Post by kyli »

I found it a bit surprising that the Kimdori didnt find out more about the oracle system from the sbip captians. But i guess they probably dont know more about the system then they told Jason.

As for not believing that the Pai ability is entirely natural, i believe it 100%. It just means the their telepathy is on the next evolutionary step when compared to other telepathic races. The karinnes created the Generations by combining feay DNA with a bit of Kimdori DNA. The Kimdori, although not telepathic themselves, are one of the oldest and most evolutionarily advanced spieces in the galaxy. When their DNA combined with feay DNA, which are very powerful telepaths, it created the Generations. There is i'm sure more to it then that of course but thats how i understand it. Now the Pai are either a pretty old race that only recently advanced in technology (maybe because they discovered the muri) or they just advanced at a quicker pace then normal. But the fact that they are older and that it took a bit longer to achieve space flight isnt a stretch since they are from a heavy gravity planet. It takes a lot more thrust to take off into orbit from a heavy gravity planet so it might have taken longer to even consider it and then figure out how to go about doing it. And evolving telepathy quicker then normal honestly isnt much of a strech either. Look at the feay and humans. One is entirely telepathic while the other has no telepathic powers except where they have a feay ancestor, yet both species are related and about the same "age" as a species. So telepathic abilities can definitely advance at slower or faster paces depending on the species.
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Re: Conviction Chapter 10 {Spoilers}

Post by SYED »

It might be possible for telepathy to narurally evolve communion, but for it to be able to near instantly communicate with artificially introduced communion is just beyond belief. For these two types to be understandable, there must be a point of common origin between the two. To me it seems you need a certain level of power and skill in telepathy just to be aware of communion, imagine what is required to actually comprehend and reply.
I wonder if the Pai genome for communion is a safer means of upgrading telepaths than kimdori. The kimdori are literally living viruses, while the Pai have un influenced telepathy. It is said that those races with out telepaths created their own, so this might be a viable method to create their own generations.

There is that system that has a slave market, surrounded by the confederation but not a member due to their practices. Any chance would the benga survey gathered intelligence about it.
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Re: Conviction Chapter 10 {Spoilers}

Post by kyli »

SYED wrote: I wonder if the Pai genome for communion is a safer means of upgrading telepaths than kimdori. The kimdori are literally living viruses, while the Pai have un influenced telepathy. It is said that those races with out telepaths created their own, so this might be a viable method to create their own generations.
I, for one, have absolutely no desire to see other races turned into Generations. I already think turning Dahnai into a Generation is a "catastrophe of epic proportions." But then, i never really liked Dahnai anyway. As the Empress of the Imperium i dont mind her but as Jason's lover i hate her. She has too much power over Jason in my opinion.

Now if the Karinnes found a safe and easy way to create telepaths, i'd be all for it. I for one, would not like to live as a non-telepath a have no protection in a world full of telepathy. Even if the ability in newly created telepaths were pitiful, it would still be enough to protect surface thoughts and know when someone is trying to invade your mind.
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Re: Conviction Chapter 10 {Spoilers}

Post by SYED »

I wonder why house karrine limited their original upgrade to their noble family, and not to the commoners in service. They had access to their advanced tech and science, so why not the treatment. Jason might limit karrine tech and science to just the house, but he does not really differentiate between the titled and non titled. It might not have been 100 percent effective and potentially deadly.
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