Capturing a super ship (potential spoilers)

Caution: Spoilers!
All about the Subjugation, Insurrection, and Unification books.

Moderator: Sennadar Moderators

Forum rules
Please Read the forum rules.
User avatar
Hello World
Initiate
Posts: 32
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2016 6:48 am

Re: Capturing a super ship (potential spoilers)

Post by Hello World »

MartinK wrote:
betatester wrote:NO its Telepathy being able to ignore distance and time. reread the chapters in conviction and you'll find the reference
Uhm, not exactly... otherwise there would be no need to put the mindstrikers into two-seat-fighters to strike at the enemy fighters. They could do so in comfort from behind the lines.
IIRC, telepathic communication does transcend space and time. Hence, biogenic chips can talk to each other in real time even across galaxies as long as you have a large enough emitter node. The reason why there are mindstrikers is only the chips can connect telepathically and they probably don't have the strength to unleash a telepathic assault.

It's kind of like how a superhero with a sonic scream attack can't use it through a phone; the phone itself has a limit on the sound it can emit.
SYED
Child of Niami
Posts: 911
Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 2:02 pm
Location: ENGLAND

Re: Capturing a super ship (potential spoilers)

Post by SYED »

Biogenics might not improve telepathic range, but they do give power. The thing is a generation can used telekinesis to defend them selves from ship fire, that implies a range increase. The only reason they don't have the ability to communicate with other telepaths, is they can't understand communion.
If only they could create a way for mundane telepaths to communicate and understand biogenics. While dangerous, could be useful.
.S.A.M.K.M
User avatar
Hello World
Initiate
Posts: 32
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2016 6:48 am

Re: Capturing a super ship (potential spoilers)

Post by Hello World »

SYED wrote:Biogenics might not improve telepathic range, but they do give power. The thing is a generation can used telekinesis to defend them selves from ship fire, that implies a range increase.
I think those are two different types of biogenic equipment. The amplifier is pretty much the equivalent of a megaphone while the communication equipment is the biogenic equivalent of a telephone. One amplifies telepathic and telekinetic abilities while the other "talks" telepathically to the chips similar to itself.
SYED
Child of Niami
Posts: 911
Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 2:02 pm
Location: ENGLAND

Re: Capturing a super ship (potential spoilers)

Post by SYED »

The confederation has the ability to use the merge systems to deploy military assets with out living beings present, the thing is due to them bring limited to a Grav band range, these military forces are trapped in only near by space. This is due to the increase time delay.
If they expand the capability of the biogenic communications network, they could deploy forces on the front line against the benga, immune to their telepathy. It would mean a communication relay set up closer to the battle, but grav band range would give them some distance away from the actual battle site. Due to the sheer number of current deployments, this might not be feasable. I was think the creation of more of those stealth frigates, but instead if aimed at ambushing targets, they were outfitted with more extensive communications system to act a relay systems for the network.
.S.A.M.K.M
SoronelHaetir
Katzh-dashi
Posts: 140
Joined: Wed Jul 24, 2013 3:07 am
Location: Smack dab in the middle of the great wet north

Re: Capturing a super ship (potential spoilers)

Post by SoronelHaetir »

Regarding the oracle and unexpected events and whether it has to be asked a question in order to make a prediction: we've already seen one event that makes me discount the idea that questions need to be posed. The Benga dropped out of hyperspace in order to avoid the interdiction trap. Given that the crews were all in some sort of stasis and had to be woken to figure out what the hell was going on I don't see posing questions being a reasonable explanation.

And I don't think the Benga in Andromeda had a chance to learn about the interdicters so it seems like the oracular ability would have to be open to information that could not be known in any sort of conventional manner.
SYED
Child of Niami
Posts: 911
Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 2:02 pm
Location: ENGLAND

Re: Capturing a super ship (potential spoilers)

Post by SYED »

The stasis/dream state allows telepathy to used to allow communication while in hyper space. So it makes sense that other gifts can also be used. This story keeps on reminding me of the movie, Minority Report. Specificly, the example the main character used about a rolling orb. It was going to fall over the edge of the table not matter what. That is why their time viewing worked. That why they had such certainty that those events will happen. The thing is the oracle system works on such a large scale, I wonder how that is achieved. I am thinking that those with the sight are placed in to a trance like state on a semi permanent basis, to make full use of their talents.

They should start gathering telepaths that posses some kind of telepathic sensory or perception based ability. I was thinking the process that allows the bEnga use of the oracle system could be adapted for these gifts as well. Their gifts might be minor, but the oracle system could make them viable abilities. My guess to use these abilities to their fullest extent, the subject needs to be placed into a specific mind state.
.S.A.M.K.M
SYED
Child of Niami
Posts: 911
Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 2:02 pm
Location: ENGLAND

Re: Capturing a super ship (potential spoilers)

Post by SYED »

I just realised a huge issue with the super ships. They would be unable to use the star gates and likely catapults. The Karrines could only make their viable as they can combine two FTL systems. So even if the confederation captures a bunch, they would be slow to deploy, and easily tracked. As well as the Karrines being practiced in their crippling.
.S.A.M.K.M
User avatar
kyli
Mi'Shara
Posts: 587
Joined: Sat Nov 02, 2013 1:38 pm
Location: Canada

Re: Capturing a super ship (potential spoilers)

Post by kyli »

SYED wrote:I just realised a huge issue with the super ships. They would be unable to use the star gates and likely catapults. The Karrines could only make their viable as they can combine two FTL systems. So even if the confederation captures a bunch, they would be slow to deploy, and easily tracked. As well as the Karrines being practiced in their crippling.
You seem to think hyperspace catapults are faster then superships. Catapults are ONLY used to allow ships that don't have real time jump engines to jump in real time. The superships have real time jump engines and are fast enough to keep up with the Confederate Fleet. They can't get through a stargate tho, except for the big stargate that the karinnes are planning on building to bring that one supership home from Andromeda. However, being limited to real time jump engines inside a galaxy isn't that big of a problem. Its intergalactic travel where you really want to go faster.

Also, i'm starting to like the idea of superships being used more as mobile forward bases for future exploration then heavy military use. Although superships can keep up with other ships in hyperspace, they are sluggish in normal space simply because they are so damn big and it takes a LOT of propulsion to move them.
"I got stabbed. After 10 days of agony, the sword died."
SYED
Child of Niami
Posts: 911
Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 2:02 pm
Location: ENGLAND

Re: Capturing a super ship (potential spoilers)

Post by SYED »

In the hands of the confed, the super ships would be more of an armed support and logistic mobile base, but in Karrine hands it would be an epic weapon. Imagine if fitted with the hybrid engine and the plasma weaponry replaced with their super ship killing weapons. That appearing and demonstrated in andromeda would really make the syndicate reconsider their plans.
.S.A.M.K.M
User avatar
kyli
Mi'Shara
Posts: 587
Joined: Sat Nov 02, 2013 1:38 pm
Location: Canada

Re: Capturing a super ship (potential spoilers)

Post by kyli »

I don't see the syndicate reconsidering anything so long as there greedy government remains in power. When they see what the karinnes can do, they will want their tech for themselves. Even if they make peace just to save themselves, i don't think it would last. The only way i can see this war end is with either the destruction for the syndicate or the toppling of their entire goverment, and maybe the takeover in their upper goverment of a different race thats not Benga.
"I got stabbed. After 10 days of agony, the sword died."
SYED
Child of Niami
Posts: 911
Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 2:02 pm
Location: ENGLAND

Re: Capturing a super ship (potential spoilers)

Post by SYED »

Sure, but it would buy the confederation time to refit their own ships and the captured one. Also, allow the Karrines to do the same. It would then allow Jason to invest his efforts in legion style tactics in andromeda. We seen how it messes with them in the field of battle, imagine the chaos they could do to the infrastructure and logistics of their empire.
.S.A.M.K.M
dstar
Sorcerer
Posts: 65
Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2004 5:58 pm

Re: Capturing a super ship (potential spoilers)

Post by dstar »

kyli wrote:
SYED wrote:I just realised a huge issue with the super ships. They would be unable to use the star gates and likely catapults. The Karrines could only make their viable as they can combine two FTL systems. So even if the confederation captures a bunch, they would be slow to deploy, and easily tracked. As well as the Karrines being practiced in their crippling.
You seem to think hyperspace catapults are faster then superships. Catapults are ONLY used to allow ships that don't have real time jump engines to jump in real time. The superships have real time jump engines and are fast enough to keep up with the Confederate Fleet.
Er.

Where is that stated?

IIRC, the Syndicate has a lack of tech as compared to the Consortium (unless I've got them backwards? I'm drunk, so I could) and the Consortium couldn't jump in realtime, or just barely could, so I wouldn't expect the Syndicate to be able to.

But you're forgetting the _huge enormous question_ that I don't think even Fel's considered:

What happens if you park a pair of stargates in hyperspace?

You think FTL-in-Hyperspace is fast? Then what would you call _that_? Super-hyper-duper-ultra-fast?
SYED
Child of Niami
Posts: 911
Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 2:02 pm
Location: ENGLAND

Re: Capturing a super ship (potential spoilers)

Post by SYED »

Super ships are large enough to set up wormhole receiving station. So constant link to home base supplying personnel and materials.
.S.A.M.K.M
User avatar
kyli
Mi'Shara
Posts: 587
Joined: Sat Nov 02, 2013 1:38 pm
Location: Canada

Re: Capturing a super ship (potential spoilers)

Post by kyli »

dstar wrote:
kyli wrote:
SYED wrote:I just realised a huge issue with the super ships. They would be unable to use the star gates and likely catapults. The Karrines could only make their viable as they can combine two FTL systems. So even if the confederation captures a bunch, they would be slow to deploy, and easily tracked. As well as the Karrines being practiced in their crippling.
You seem to think hyperspace catapults are faster then superships. Catapults are ONLY used to allow ships that don't have real time jump engines to jump in real time. The superships have real time jump engines and are fast enough to keep up with the Confederate Fleet.
Er.

Where is that stated?

IIRC, the Syndicate has a lack of tech as compared to the Consortium (unless I've got them backwards? I'm drunk, so I could) and the Consortium couldn't jump in realtime, or just barely could, so I wouldn't expect the Syndicate to be able to.

But you're forgetting the _huge enormous question_ that I don't think even Fel's considered:

What happens if you park a pair of stargates in hyperspace?

You think FTL-in-Hyperspace is fast? Then what would you call _that_? Super-hyper-duper-ultra-fast?
It takes the syndicate 5 years to cross the void between galaxies, just like any other empire with real time jump engines. Besides, i think it actually does state somewhere that they stole real time jump engines tech from the consortium. But i'd have to look for the reference. In any case, i think its fairly obvious the syndicate has real time jump engines. If they didn't, they never could keep their ships ahead of the Confederate Fleet, since it would have taken weeks, if not months to just travel across the galaxy. Real time engines are super fast when compared with engines that suffer from relativity.

As for using stargates in hyperspace; i think the technology is incompatible. Wormholes (stargates) are already nearly instantaneous +/- a few micro-seconds. The only problem comes with keeping the wormhole stable, which requires a stargate on the other side of the wormhole. That really the biggest limit to stargate tech. Hyperspace travel and stargate travel are entirely different modes of travel. One creates a wormhole by bending two points in space together, while the other is actual travel between those two point in space in the higher dimensions, or something light that.
"I got stabbed. After 10 days of agony, the sword died."
Locked